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Re: I sense something. Something I've not felt since...

Posted: Wed Dec 10, 2014 4:57 am
by wasp609
Mr Bojangles wrote:
wasp609 wrote:many cloned storm troopers were not clones of jango anymore, they were cloned from many other templates, though some of the jango clones did remain. But most stormtroopers were recruits from the populace later in the war. Interestingly enough many of the jango clones considered the rest of the corps incompetent idiots.
Well, considering most of the Troopers in episodes 4, 5 and 6 would have trouble hitting the broadside of a Star Destroyer at point-blank range, I can see why the Jango-clones would think that.
well it can be taken two ways, done for effect in the film or they are idiots. though i think they are just idiots. another thing if the jedi can sense bad things why didnt they sense the clones turning.

Re: I sense something. Something I've not felt since...

Posted: Wed Dec 10, 2014 6:43 am
by fredgiblet
IIRC the official answer is that the Jedi feel things like anger and hate. The clones didn't hate the Jedi or feel anger towards them, they were simply following an order without particular feeling.

Re: I sense something. Something I've not felt since...

Posted: Wed Dec 10, 2014 7:19 am
by Arioch
wasp609 wrote:
Mr Bojangles wrote:
wasp609 wrote:many cloned storm troopers were not clones of jango anymore, they were cloned from many other templates, though some of the jango clones did remain. But most stormtroopers were recruits from the populace later in the war. Interestingly enough many of the jango clones considered the rest of the corps incompetent idiots.
Well, considering most of the Troopers in episodes 4, 5 and 6 would have trouble hitting the broadside of a Star Destroyer at point-blank range, I can see why the Jango-clones would think that.
well it can be taken two ways, done for effect in the film or they are idiots. though i think they are just idiots. another thing if the jedi can sense bad things why didnt they sense the clones turning.
Since Kenobi makes a point of saying that Imperial troops are known for being precise, I think one has to assume that they're constantly missing the heroes because it's Hollywood, and not because they're supposed to be incompetent. The stormtroopers boarding the Tantive IV didn't seem to have any trouble slaughtering the rebel defenders, so if the Imperial troops are incompetent, then the rebels must be even more so.

Re: I sense something. Something I've not felt since...

Posted: Wed Dec 10, 2014 12:09 pm
by discord
actually, episode 4, how exactly do you follow someone that you have put a tracking device on if they are all dead? the troopers had orders to let them get away.

Re: I sense something. Something I've not felt since...

Posted: Fri Dec 12, 2014 2:23 am
by Mr Bojangles
Arioch wrote:Since Kenobi makes a point of saying that Imperial troops are known for being precise, I think one has to assume that they're constantly missing the heroes because it's Hollywood, and not because they're supposed to be incompetent. The stormtroopers boarding the Tantive IV didn't seem to have any trouble slaughtering the rebel defenders, so if the Imperial troops are incompetent, then the rebels must be even more so.
discord wrote:actually, episode 4, how exactly do you follow someone that you have put a tracking device on if they are all dead? the troopers had orders to let them get away.
So, Selective Plot-driven Incompetence. Because, yeah, those Troopers helped conquer and hold a galaxy, and they weren't always tracking the plucky heroes. They had to be professional at least some of the time.

Re: I sense something. Something I've not felt since...

Posted: Fri Dec 12, 2014 2:55 am
by Nemo
Makes sense. As they said, stormies totally run over the rebels in the Tantive IV and put them on the defensive for years following Yavin IV. And kick ass in the invasion of Hoth. This is a supportable theory. And then: Ewoks.

Seriously, at the end of the day its not the Rebels or even the Jedi that destroy the Empire. Its the Care Bears. /sigh

Re: I sense something. Something I've not felt since...

Posted: Fri Dec 12, 2014 5:40 am
by Arioch
Return of the Jedi is the weakest of the trilogy in nearly every respect. It's the movie in which you first start to suspect that Lucas was not quite the genius that everyone thought he was.

Re: I sense something. Something I've not felt since...

Posted: Fri Apr 17, 2015 5:12 pm
by Nemo
Query, what do you think was the weakest scene of the weakest episode? Had to be the bridge scene with Luke and Leia right? Lets make a trailer featuring it!

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wCc2v7izk8w

Re: I sense something. Something I've not felt since...

Posted: Fri Apr 17, 2015 6:38 pm
by Siber
I have trouble finding fault with RotJ, possibly because I was so young when I first saw it. I can see why people have problems with the things they do, but at the very least all the character stuff seems very solid to this day. That trailer works perfectly fine to me, with the weakest points in my mind being the spectacle. My jaded mind has trouble accepting some if it these days.

Re: I sense something. Something I've not felt since...

Posted: Fri Apr 17, 2015 7:48 pm
by Arioch
Return of the Jedi was good, especially when compared to the newer triology, but I think it falls a little flat in terms of characterization, compared with the first two movies. In particular, I didn't like the way Darth Vader was portrayed. In Empire Strike Back, Vader is a terrifying figure... a menace even to his own side, whether he's executing subordinates or plotting the overthrow of the Emperor. In some ways this is over the top, but I think it illustrates the fearsome power of the Dark Side of the Force. The thought that went through my mind when Vader revealed that he was Luke's father was this: the Dark Side has the power to make a father try to kill his own son without any shred of remorse... it's truly something to be feared. In A New Hope, the Dark Side is an abstract concept, but in Empire it becomes visceral.

In Jedi, in contrast, Vader seems passive and indecisive; he becomes a mere slave of the Emperor; presumably the writers and attempting to shift the blame for his deeds so that he can be more easily redeemed. One might think that having doubts and remorse would make a character more complex, but it's ham-handed and doesn't make sense in terms of what we know about the Sith and the Dark Side -- "It's too late for me, son" and "I must obey my master" are things that don't make any sense for a Dark Jedi to say. The Dark Side makes you believe that what you're doing is right -- otherwise, you wouldn't do it; and blind obedience is not a Sith virtue. In addition to making Vader seem weak, it telegraphs his switch -- you can see the final scene coming a mile away. How much more amazing would it have been if Vader had been an Empire-style badass through the entire movie, with the Emperor treating him like a dangerous rival instead of a lapdog, and then in the climactic scene, after Luke defeats him, he has a moment of clarity and realizes that he has only been a pawn and fed the Emperor his own son... and then suddenly turns on his former master. It would have been unexpected and satisfying.

And then it also would have been nice if, when unmasked, he didn't turn out to be a puffy old man.

Speaking of which, I don't know how they're going to work the aged original cast in without it being laughable. At least Chewie still looks good.

Re: I sense something. Something I've not felt since...

Posted: Sat Apr 18, 2015 4:31 am
by Siber
I don't know about the rest of them, but Ford was still pretty credible recently in Cowboys vs Aliens.

Re: I sense something. Something I've not felt since...

Posted: Sat Apr 18, 2015 7:07 am
by icekatze
hi hi

I'm pretty sure the old cast is mostly going to be there to pass the baton, as it were, to the new cast. The new cast being that storm trooper and what's-her-name that helps him out, who are going to pick up the quest from the old timers who will undoubtedly say something along the lines of, "I need your help. She needs your help. I'm getting too old for this sort of thing."

Re: I sense something. Something I've not felt since...

Posted: Sat Apr 18, 2015 6:00 pm
by Codius_Dak

Re: I sense something. Something I've not felt since...

Posted: Sat Apr 18, 2015 6:38 pm
by dragoongfa
Now that's awesome.

Re: I sense something. Something I've not felt since...

Posted: Sat Apr 18, 2015 7:49 pm
by discord
leaning ball-bot....

Re: I sense something. Something I've not felt since...

Posted: Sun Apr 19, 2015 1:19 pm
by Nemo

Give the man a medal. Music wasnt bad, didn't think it fit, but the animation was incredible. Can't help but wonder how long it took him to cut all of that together. Loved all the references too. Hud and cockpit displays out of the games, briefing officer etc.

Re: I sense something. Something I've not felt since...

Posted: Mon Apr 20, 2015 8:43 am
by TrashMan
discord wrote:but but but, swords got those pointy things therefor they should be on lightsabers....ouch.
silly clunky speeder was silly.
the whack rolling droid was kinda cool though, not much more to say.
except, non-clone storm troopers is good.


The swords got those things (handguards) for 3 reasons:
1) leverage
2) Balance
3) protecting your arm from being chopped off by the opponent simply sliding his blade down yours


Also, I did it before it was cool:
Image

Cortosis hand-guard tough.

https://encrypted-tbn1.gstatic.com/imag ... 1BOw5QKh7A

Re: I sense something. Something I've not felt since...

Posted: Mon Apr 20, 2015 8:53 am
by TrashMan
EU is garbage. Sewage. Aside from a few gems (Thrawn?), it's all S***.

Fanboys writing bad SW stories and taking things from their other favorite universes/character, until it turns into a chaotic mess as every Tom, Dick and Harry masturbates into the cauldron.

Re: I sense something. Something I've not felt since...

Posted: Mon Apr 20, 2015 11:02 am
by discord
trashman: I know what they are modeled after.
#1 leverage against what? with a ordinary sword you can hook and trap the opponents sword, that would not work with a lightsaber due to a few reasons, simplest is the 'trapped' blade can vanish and reappear at the user whim.
<edit> i suppose you could use the hold on them for extra power, specifically the thumb, but that comes at a cost of stability. </edit>
#2 balance, true the orientation of the edge is easier with a simple crossguard, but there is no edge to orient.... moving point of balance closer to the hilt....there is no weight to the blade and therefor this function is null and void and possibly counter productive due to increased weight.
#3 due to lightsaber 'stickyness' being quite proven, sliding along the edge is much less of a problem anyhow, but even disregarding that the lightsaber crossguards do not extend all the way in, so a sliding blade meet metal, not lightsaber blade....and the result should be obvious.
a cortosis weave crossguard could make sense, but since historically lightsabers are not coated that way it would be of dubious effectiveness,

which leaves us with the following reasons for it's existence.
#1 extra pokey/cutey utensils, which is quickly outweighed by the increased risk of hurting yourself.
#2 rule of uncool(that people that do not understand weapons will add pointless doodads to make them look cool, and fail.)
the last of which was the reason for my "but but but, swords got those pointy things therefor they should be on lightsabers....ouch." comment, the last part was a indication of how this stupidity was literally hurting my sensibilities


and just in case the result is not obvious, the crossguard piece gets sliced and destroyed shortly before your "protected" hand gets the same treatment.

bottom line, silly, stupid and ugly things that are not cool.

Re: I sense something. Something I've not felt since...

Posted: Mon Apr 20, 2015 8:32 pm
by Sweforce
The main function of the odd lightsaber crossguard is to allow for an easy way for the wielder to commit suicide by the slashing up the stomach with it. Finally seppucu have been adopted by the jedi order. :p