Outcast Quest [Updated 10/10/18 - Turn 14]

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dragoongfa
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Re: Outcast Quest [Updated 19/7/16 - Turn 12]

Post by dragoongfa »

It was obvious that the collars are a major asset and researching them is a mid to long term goal but for now our options are extremely limited in regards to it.

First we need willing telepathic allies. The children are friendly with us but there are 36 of them without any meaningful knowledge or skills in telepathic matters, at best they can be guinea pigs with everything that entails.

This means that the expedition to find their people is a priority, their House will certainly be impressed with us rescuing them and discreetly bringing news about the collars to them. Once that is done its up to the Loroi on how to proceed.

If Icefury is smart and wise enough she will want to know how these things work in which case several aspects of cooperation open to us depending on how she chooses to proceed.

However for now our immediate goals are threefold:

1) Prepare for the expedition to the Loroi.
2) Enhance our research potential.
3) Find a cure to the jump sickness so our full potential is at our disposal.

EDIT: Don't forget that we didn't dismantle our jump drive for a reason. It wasn't just for the bragging rights, the jump drive may prove useful to us later in much the same way.

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Re: Outcast Quest [Updated 19/7/16 - Turn 12]

Post by Shrewfoot »

I don't necessarily disagree with your analysis Dragoongfa. Though I do wonder what you think about Razor One's hints about the succulent research option. The reason I think we should add Learning Urkuk to the list of priorities is because we do have their database and we have a chance as a newcomer of not pissing them off at least, and maybe even getting on their good side. it would be in the Urkuk's best interest as a species to become close allies with a longer living race in order to increase their tech level and maybe eventually lengthen their life spans. We could find some really important strategic information in their logs too.

While I also do want to analyze the jump logs... and its possible that this is what Razor was hinting at... it seems less likely? This is why I want some more opinions on this issue. At the very least I think we should learn their language and study their logs before we embark to return the Loroi.
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Re: Outcast Quest [Updated 19/7/16 - Turn 12]

Post by dragoongfa »

The problem with the Urkuk approach is that the language option is too limited as is and I don't think we will have much chance with them becoming friendly since they are essentially space borne barbarians for the most part. Us knowing Urkuk will certainly help when we blow up some of them and board the wrecks for loot and intel but as it is now even a single turn researching Urkuk is a wasted turn.

The Jump analysis is what I think that Razor One was getting at in regards to the research possibilities, that and the drone path.

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Re: Outcast Quest [Updated 19/7/16 - Turn 12]

Post by Absalom »

Changed vote
Siber wrote:I'd like to point out that unless I goofed my math somehow, jump sickness is going to take us an average of 24 turns to finish at our current rates... but on the other hand, the sci anex only takes about 4 turns off that.

Edit: My math was a bit wrong, it's actually 21 turns to start.
Thanks for the correction, I hadn't checked that. New vote:

Elections
[X] Homesteading Party

Martial:
[X] Combat Exercises

'Cause seriously, fumes. I recall that one of the options in the emergency we couldn't do because we didn't have resources saved up: this is no way to run an isolated outpost.


Diplomacy:
[X] The Common Folk

Intrigue:
[X] Keeping An Ear Out

Learning:
[X] Jump Transit Analysis

This should take two to four turns if we get good rolls. Unless it's related to the language itself, Urkuk will only pay off when reviewing seized records (though it would give the Blue Rose something else to do).

Personal:
[X] Spending Time with Doctor Campos


dragoongfa wrote:This means that the expedition to find their people is a priority, their House will certainly be impressed with us rescuing them and discreetly bringing news about the collars to them. Once that is done its up to the Loroi on how to proceed.

If Icefury is smart and wise enough she will want to know how these things work in which case several aspects of cooperation open to us depending on how she chooses to proceed.
Agreed, the collars are essentially trade goods whose use (who we sell them to) will affect our relationship with the Loroi.
dragoongfa wrote:However for now our immediate goals are threefold:

1) Prepare for the expedition to the Loroi.
2) Enhance our research potential.
3) Find a cure to the jump sickness so our full potential is at our disposal.
I partially disagree. I place the goals as follows:

1) Produce a resource buffer as insurance against the unexpected: remember, we don't have the capability to replace the current mine.
2) Enhance our resource production potential: strong science (or strong anything, really) requires a strong economy to support it's infrastructural needs.
3) Find a cure to the jump sickness so our full potential is at our disposal.

You might notice that all three are entertwined with economics: if you're barely scraping by (like the colony currently is) then your economy is unhealthy. In the current situation, if the mine had to be closed for some reason, that would basically be it: no more colony, because everyone would sooner or later die in the absence of the mine, and there aren't enough resources to build a new one.

Now, the actual cure itself I would rank as important but not necessarily critical. The economic situation I would rate as critical, though if we use enough caution the problem should just go away. The Loroi expedition I wouldn't consider critical, but I can see treating it as if it had a time limit.

Research potential, on the other hand, is neither critical nor time-limited. I rank it right along with the cure: important, but if we place it as more important than other matters then we're just shooting ourselves in the foot (I initially voted cure for lack of anything to mae me prefer something else).
Shrewfoot wrote:I don't necessarily disagree with your analysis Dragoongfa. Though I do wonder what you think about Razor One's hints about the succulent research option. The reason I think we should add Learning Urkuk to the list of priorities is because we do have their database and we have a chance as a newcomer of not pissing them off at least, and maybe even getting on their good side. it would be in the Urkuk's best interest as a species to become close allies with a longer living race in order to increase their tech level and maybe eventually lengthen their life spans. We could find some really important strategic information in their logs too.
Selling the Loroi info on the Urkuk's theoretical employers might get some brownie points, yes.
Shrewfoot wrote:While I also do want to analyze the jump logs... and its possible that this is what Razor was hinting at... it seems less likely?
It might indicate any number of useful things... and more importantly, it's fast. Possibly done in 3 turns, and we'll get some immediate hint of it's applicability, whereas learning Urkuk might be fast, but getting any reward off of it is almost certain to require more actions later on.
Shrewfoot wrote:This is why I want some more opinions on this issue. At the very least I think we should learn their language and study their logs before we embark to return the Loroi.
If we can research the logs on the way then we can delay that bit, but certainly we should be ready to study them within a turn of heading out.

dragoongfa wrote:The problem with the Urkuk approach is that the language option is too limited as is and I don't think we will have much chance with them becoming friendly since they are essentially space borne barbarians for the most part. Us knowing Urkuk will certainly help when we blow up some of them and board the wrecks for loot and intel but as it is now even a single turn researching Urkuk is a wasted turn.
On the other hand, there are several different tribes, they reproduce quickly, and their short lifespans mean that we'll have ample oppourtunity to manipulate and assimilate any that we don't get into a shooting match with: the Urkuk are the best option to grow the economy, even if we find other humans, because they're the ones that reproduce the fastest.
dragoongfa wrote:The Jump analysis is what I think that Razor One was getting at in regards to the research possibilities, that and the drone path.
I'm not really sure about the Jump analysis, but if it has a hidden payoff, then I think we'll know faster than with Urkuk. Who knows, maybe a constant, minor jump field will be enough to lessen jump sickness. Maybe a jump field will allow for crude spatial manipulation, producing a "shove" effect. Maybe a jump field will create a "stasis field", creating temporary invulnerability at the cost of no actions until the field turns off.

Only one way to know.

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Siber
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Re: Outcast Quest [Updated 19/7/16 - Turn 12]

Post by Siber »

I can agree that getting a resource buffer is very good idea, and should be a high priority item. However, I disagree when it comes to the import of jump sickness. The last wave was noted to come with some seizures. Practically any activity is potentially fatal when you add seizures into it. What if that were to happen to us as we were cruising into combat? We're lucky if we didn't lose any miners to episodes,and also lucky if it has no impact on our future generation. And we don't know if that's the worst it can get, either. I would consider solving that problem to be of paramount importance.

edit: Also, by my math(which is now slightly less flawed than it was this morning, so, grain of salt I guess) it's not actually possible for us to get jump transit research done in 3 turns unless jump sickness clears entirely, and if it stays at this level we can expect an average research time of 5 turns for it(and I prefer to plan for the average rather than for good rolls)
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Re: Outcast Quest [Updated 19/7/16 - Turn 12]

Post by Tamri »

With regard to "treat Lorai" and in general medicines: How do you treat them all together? Well, about the people it is clear - the new colony should be with a certain individual stock of medicines. But I don't remember that we would have been in the presence of a complex for the production and synthesis of drugs, exactly as their sources. Study Lorai biochemistry maximum that we will - the ability to avoid future problems related to poisoning and intoxication, ie, nutrition and care for them.

And about the medicines - I have made a search for possible drug synthesis in one of the main points, because sooner or later, our supply of drugs comes to an end, and it will be fun.

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Re: Outcast Quest [Updated 19/7/16 - Turn 12]

Post by Absalom »

Tamri wrote:With regard to "treat Lorai" and in general medicines: How do you treat them all together? Well, about the people it is clear - the new colony should be with a certain individual stock of medicines. But I don't remember that we would have been in the presence of a complex for the production and synthesis of drugs, exactly as their sources. Study Lorai biochemistry maximum that we will - the ability to avoid future problems related to poisoning and intoxication, ie, nutrition and care for them.

And about the medicines - I have made a search for possible drug synthesis in one of the main points, because sooner or later, our supply of drugs comes to an end, and it will be fun.
The data drives should hopefully cover the instructions for drug manufacturing. After that, it's a matter of building, configuring, and using equipment, in accordance with instructions.

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Re: Outcast Quest [Updated 19/7/16 - Turn 12]

Post by Tamri »

Absalom wrote:The data drives should hopefully cover the instructions for drug manufacturing. After that, it's a matter of building, configuring, and using equipment, in accordance with instructions.
One thing - to know how to do them. Other - to have equipment for production. And the third - to have the raw material for production. With the first we hypothetically no problems. Equipment is also in principle not a problem when we finish the production complex. But with the third paragraph may be problems. Because about a third of the raw material for medicines - plant or animal origin, and some part of the mineral and organic resources, we in sufficient quantity in the current conditions hardly find. Thus, at least a quarter of the necessary theoretical preparations we cannot produce, or even half. Because of what have to look for alternatives, and it is better to do UNTIL our supply of drugs not comes to an end.

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Re: Outcast Quest [Updated 19/7/16 - Turn 12]

Post by Razor One »

Survey is now up.

Please Click Here To Vote

Regarding medical supplies, you did choose to bring a fair cache along with you in your initial startup, though that will dwindle over time. I'll see about revamping a few of the stewardship options next turn to both account for medical manufacturing, which will be an adjunct of the Biolab, and revise a few of the bonuses to be somewhat stronger / more clear.
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Re: Outcast Quest [Updated 21/7/16 - Turn 12 Survey Open]

Post by dragoongfa »

Voted with this in mind:
[X] Frontier Party. Learning about our surroundings is the best means of defense.
[X] Common Folk. The condition of our jump sickness worsened so it must be addressed ASAP.
[X] Whalers of the Sky. The CIWS can wait a couple of turns and I hope that this will improve our Learning somewhat (plus cheaper for us, opens more options).
[X] Keeping an ear out. The damn whales are currently a sonic beacon to our position
[X] Loroi Biochemistry. It may end up saving the life of one of our guests and it could potentially boost our Jump sickness research since the don't get jump sickness, also it has the potential of getting finished early and us wasting only a couple of turns on it.
[X] Spending time with Colonel Pierce. Its time we get 'Pierced'
@Absalom

Our resources income is 6000 RUs per turn so we have no problem with our income at the moment. We can expand it easily too.

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Re: Outcast Quest [Updated 21/7/16 - Turn 12 Survey Open]

Post by Siber »

I have also voted along those lines.
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Re: Outcast Quest [Updated 21/7/16 - Turn 12 Survey Open]

Post by Absalom »

Voted according to my last post.
dragoongfa wrote:@Absalom

Our resources income is 6000 RUs per turn so we have no problem with our income at the moment. We can expand it easily too.
Income is not the problem, buffer is the problem. I will repeat what I said before: if the mine has to be abandoned then there will be zero chance of replacing it, because we have been burning through resources instead of stockpiling them.

Saying "everything is fine" is indeed fine when you've put backup plans in place, but we are not in that position. Instead, we're in a position where a single link is the only thing keeping our glass house from plummeting to our certain death. It is well past time to add a backup to that link, even if it only serves to make the fall survivable.

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Re: Outcast Quest [Updated 21/7/16 - Turn 12 Survey Open]

Post by Razor One »

The problems with your resource acquisition were more to do with certain externalities.

For instance, you used mining charges to deal with Fenrir's break up, which halved your income, sent your people to a fallout shelter in the mine, which nerfed your income again, and then had to take your light ore refinery offline to power the colonial point defense laser you built out of spare parts from the L'Amour, nerfing your income yet again.

None of that was due to dwindling resources though. Your mine is actually stupidly rich in resources. You could mine it for a thousand years at your current rate and never run dry. You're situated on a flying mountain of precious and base metals, one of hundreds of such asteroids that you've seen so far in the Briar Patch, which likely contains millions of such planetesimals floating about in it's proto-jovian-like atmosphere.

Not to say that a second mining operation isn't a good idea. It is, but two of the three factors that nerfed your income for the main mine would apply for your secondary mine as well; the lack of mining charges and power for the light ore refinery. The third factor, the fallout shelter, was a once-off. There'd also be the factor of ferrying ore and supplies to and from the facility, which would use your remaining shuttles. You'd need to start building new freight shuttles to augment your existing ones, which would necessitate a dock and warehousing.

Vote's gonna stay open until I get off work tonight or diplomacy stops being tied, whichever comes first. If the vote is till tied, I'll be rolling heads or tails for whatever you wind up doing.
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Re: Outcast Quest [Updated 21/7/16 - Turn 12 Survey Open]

Post by Shrewfoot »

So... seeing as no one's talking and it's been 4 days on this Razor One. Will you do that coin flip or has the survey divulged something more?
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Re: Outcast Quest [Updated 21/7/16 - Turn 12 Survey Open]

Post by dragoongfa »

Razor is a busy person and sometimes he is late

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Re: Outcast Quest [Updated 21/7/16 - Turn 12 Survey Open]

Post by Razor One »

Yep, sorry for the delay, been a wee bit busy.

Here's the results:

[X] Frontier Party
[X] Whalers of the Sky
[X] The Common Folk
[X] Keeping An Ear Out
[X] Loroi Biochemistry
[X] Spending Time with Colonel Pierce

Rolled a 1d2 for Working Relations (1) or Common Folk (2), you rolled a two so Common Folk won.

Gonna work on the update over the next day or two. Might be as soon as tonight if I'm not feeling too wrecked.
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Re: Outcast Quest [Updated 27/7/16 - Turn 12 Survey Closed]

Post by Razor One »

And here you go.

Turn 12 Results

Elections

[X] Frontier Party

Jonathan Spencer leads what is called the Frontier Party. Their goals are to investigate this new area of space as thoroughly as possible, find a way home, and discover all that can be discovered about aliens. They are, in essence, a party of knowledge and discovery.

+15 To Learning Actions
+15 To military and intrigue actions that increase knowledge of the region

Frontier Party Votes: 5d100 + 1d30 = 52 + 66 + 24 + 17 + 12 + 1 = 172 + 3d100 (Captains Favour) = 172 + 123 = 295

Homesteading Party: 5d100 + 1d30 = 26 + 97 + 1 + 10 + 85 + 17 = 236

-The Frontier Party has won the election with a slim majority. Jonathan Spencer promises to lead the civilian aspects of your government fairly as soon as he’s sworn in as Prime Minister for your colony and will begin redirecting social policy once the apparatus for good governance is in place. Vanessa Hughes has decided to step back from public life to focus on motherhood for a while, but promises to return in the next election, three years (Turn 48) from now.

Reward: Your civilian population feels better represented and more in control. Bonuses to learning, military and intrigue actions apply from Turn 13.

Military

[X] Whalers of the Sky: Ever since the discovery of life flying about in the Briar Patch, the prospect of samples to work with has been on most people's lips. With them being so close by, it’s almost too good an opportunity to acquire some samples.

Cost: 1000 RU, Time: 2 Months, Chance of Success: 70%, Reward: New research options, ???, ???

Rolled: 80 + 18 - 6 = 92, Great Success!

-It’s almost scary how quickly the marines managed to rig up a harpoon system for your existing shuttles. It was even scarier how O’Malley managed to coordinate the shuttles against one of the bigger whales to bring it down without damaging it too badly. The other whales seemed both confused and petrified by what they’d seen. It seems being hunted is such an out of context problem for them that they’re likely to freeze up again should you need to hunt them again.

Reward: Biological Whale Samples obtained! Tactical Research Round unlocked! Whales confused.

Diplomacy

[X] The Common Folk: Between the upper echelons of your society and the military, you haven't had much of a chance to talk to the average people of your colony in a cordial and unofficial manner, and while everyone is working hard there's always a chance to converse with regular folk in the mess.

Cost: 0, Time: 1 Month, Chance of Success: 60%, Reward: Vox Populi becomes available.

Rolled: 33 + 19 - 6 + 2 = 48, Success!

-You spend the next month in the colonial mess and commons areas meeting people and generally trying to get an idea of who your colonists are and how they’re doing. They’re a bit reticent to talk to you at first, more used to you being distant or someone they’ve seen during the debate livestreams.

You eventually manage to crack through their hesitance and before long you’ve managed to build up a network of acquaintances who are happy to have a chat with you.

Reward: Vox Populi now available.

Stewardship

[X] Industrial Autoplant: Unpack your industrial equipment and start churning out finished goods.

Cost: 500 RU, 150 RU Upkeep, Time: 3 Months, Chance of Success: 100%, Reward: +50% Base Income from Mining

-Ah, the sounds of industry. It sounds like music to your ears. Your colonists are much happier at not having to build a lot of base components, such as sheet metal, themselves and leave the robots to do their work, loudly, if efficiently.

Reward: +50% Bonus Income from base mining yield. Applies next turn.

[X] Fuel Refinery: Harvests the surrounding hydrogen rich atmosphere and converts it into delicious fuel for your ships to burn.

Cost: 2000 RU, Time: 2 Months, Chance of Success: 80%, Reward: Ship automatically refuels while at home.

Rolled: 34 + 17 - 6 = 45, Success!

-The fuel refinery begins drawing in and filtering the contaminants from the surrounding gas. Before long, your colonists have tweaked the process and machinery to give you all the fuel the L’Amour could need, or store for that matter.

Reward: L’Amour will automatically refuel to capacity while at home base.

Intrigue

[X] Keeping An Ear Out: Amongst the many skills provided by the Blue Rose, signals intelligence is one of the more common and expected. With the whales all but broadcasting your position for all to hear and see, it’s possible someone might come to investigate. Listening in on various frequencies might tip you off if that happens.

Cost: 0, Time: ??? Chance of Success: ??? Reward: Hopefully early warning?, ???

Rolled: 25

-It frustrates you that you’re still not quite sure exactly who the Blue Rose is, because you honestly wish you could yell at them. Nothing but failure for the entire month, with excuses ranging from whale interference to the unfamiliar environment and even blaming things on the light second barrier. O’Malley does take you task on your frustration though, saying that their explanation made perfect sense.

One thing did come of it though. By the end the Blue Rose did hit upon a method of discerning possible hostiles in the soup that is your home; Sonar. Unfortunately, the Blue Rose specialised in the void of space, not as part of a blue water navy. They’re going to need practice to get good.

Reward: Sonar Monitoring action unlocked.

Learning

[X] Loroi Biochemistry: Doctor Campos would like to do a more detailed study into Loroi biochemistry to determine with certainty what foods the Loroi can handle as well as derive what nutrients they require to fully recover from their ordeal in addition to what medicines they're able to consume.

Cost: 0, Value Needed: 301 / 650, Difficulty: Medium (2d100 + Learning), Reward: Knowledge of what is and is not toxic to Loroi biochemistry.

Rolled: 56 + 61 + 19 - 6 + 23 (Clinic) = 153 + 301 = 454 / 650

-Doctor Campos reports some progress on research the Loroi’s biochemical makeup. It’s still a tough slog, all things given, but headway is being made.

Personal

[X] Spending Time with Colonel Pierce: Colonel Pierce has suggested that you undergo the same anti-interrogation training that his marines go through. He does not promise to be gentle.

Cost: 0, Time: 1 Month, Chance of Success: 70/40/20%, Reward: +1/+2/+3 Intrigue, Increased "Closeness" with Colonel Pierce.

Rolled: 97 + 14 - 6 = 105, Critical Success!

-Colonel Pierce said that at some point during the month a little ‘test’ of your abilities to resist interrogation would take place. He never said when, only saying that it would be a ‘surprise’.

Well, you heard them coming. When they busted in your door, faces covered to hide their identities, and tried to pull a black bag over your head you fought back. They overpowered you all the same but you were still ready for them. Over the next month, both you and Colonel Pierce share the ‘experience’ of being captured, detained, and interrogated. You experience everything from harsh questioning, waterboarding, to borderline torture.

What really surprised Colonel Pierce though was during the last week. You managed to get the drop on one of the guards with an improvised prison shank and managed to escape. That ended the training a little early, with the Colonel stoically reporting you did far better than he expected.

Reward: +4 Intrigue, gained the trait ‘Unbreakable’, your character will not break under mundane torture or interrogation. Colonel Pierce is slightly afraid of you.

--

Tactical turn for the whales will come later. Preferably when my eyes aren't stabbing me.

<< Turn 12 || Turn 13 >>
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dragoongfa
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Re: Outcast Quest [Updated 27/7/16 - Turn 12 Survey Closed]

Post by dragoongfa »

Nice...

Hopefully Loroi Bio will get very close to finish next month in which case we will let the computer finish it.

The +4 Intrigue is awesome as well.

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Re: Outcast Quest [Updated 27/7/16 - Turn 12 Survey Closed]

Post by Siber »

We've got non-zero odds of finishing loroi bio next turn, in fact. Looks like the bonuses to learning actions has dropped our average time on Uruk down to 2 turns, and jump sickness to 7, assuming no worsening of jump sickness.

I do have another mechanics question though. You gave the breakdown for learning as:
56 + 61 + 19 - 6 + 23 (Clinic)

So I'm guessing that's 1d100+1d100+learning-jump sickness+1d50? That'd the doc's learning, not ours, it would appear, so it's the advisers stats that matter to all these, not our personal stats? That somewhat adjusts the value of the statups from personal actions I suppose, but makes sense as well.

My apologies if you went over all this before, you probably did, but there's a lot of posts to search through.
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Re: Outcast Quest [Updated 27/7/16 - Turn 12 Results]

Post by dragoongfa »

Yes its the adviser's stats that help with the various official stuff. This will keep being the case until our stats actually surpass the ones from our advisers.

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