Automated torpedo defense

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Aleena
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Automated torpedo defense

Post by Aleena »

I had a fun idea for a random device: a computer controlled drone; little more than a torpedo launcher bolted to a big engine. It is intended to be an effective means of delivering a large quantity of cheap ordinance to a hostile ship or fleet. There would be somewhere between thousands and billions of them, synchronously surging towards their target while launching torpedoes just before contact. Many would likely be destroyed by defensive fire. The survivors would return to a specialized dock for reloading, refueling and another pass, if required.

With a fairly light mass and nimble maneuverability, the drone can accelerate up to the maximum stress load of its hardware or the maximum delta of its engines, likely far exceeding the 35G limit imposed on larger, crewed ships. The automated torpedo defense drones are intended to be on average less costly than an equivalent number of cruise missiles -- drone losses are expected, but by divorcing the expensive engine, fuel and guidance systems from the ordinance, the launcher has at least the capability of being reused.

There are some drawbacks to this weapon. It would require dedicated factories to rapidly build the drones in quantity and orbital facilities to rapidly reload and refuel the drones. This would take resources away from building larger, more versatile crewed ships. While I expect the drones would be effective against a traditional fleet, one possible countermeasure could be specialized 'flak' turrets that fire clouds of metal and debris. High speed impact with even tiny objects can cause massive damage to a space vessel. Thus, I believe such weapons would create additional hazards even for crewed starships.

What do the Outsiders think?

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Sprawl63
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Re: Automated torpedo defense

Post by Sprawl63 »

I'd think having multiple missiles jammed into a drone would be a disadvantage compared to a normal salvo. It would just provide the enemy the chance to take out multiple missiles with one shot. With all that mass of propulsion systems and the missiles, the drones would be pretty sluggish without much operational range. You would also have to store missiles inside of a drone inside of a ship. Besides, the purpose of missiles/torpedoes in Outsider is to soften up and distract the enemy rather then destroy them outright. You might as well just... shoot missiles.

Your suggestion is somewhat similar to missile pods in the Honor Harrington books. Later in the series, ships would lug around several missile pods; simple launchers without any means of self propulsion that are capable of launching a dozen or more missiles by themselves. Multiply that by the number of ships in a fleet and the ships missiles themselves, and you get opening salvos that number in the tens (hundreds?) of thousands. By the latest two books, battles are decided by that opening salvo alone. Macross missile massacre every time.

TrashMan
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Re: Automated torpedo defense

Post by TrashMan »

You're describing missile busses.

Their effectiveness would be questionble methinks. Technicly, you can fire torpedos from the other side of the system (and have them coast to perserve fuel) so range is a non-issue.

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icekatze
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Re: Automated torpedo defense

Post by icekatze »

hi hi

This is a lot like the Tolot Blisters no? So I think they already use something similar anyway... Just doesn't seem very likely for any of them to survive to return and refuel. Unfortunately in space combat, the ability to turn around and return puts things at a significant disadvantage from things that are one use because they need a lot more propellant. I imagine that the Loroi interceptors would have some serious fuel concerns if they needed to make a full 1 light second charge at an enemy position and return.

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Aleena
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Re: Automated torpedo defense

Post by Aleena »

I like that, "missile bus."

Anyways, I was just idly wondering at how to improve relatively static and helpless orbital and surface defenses described by Arioch, and thought a self-guided reusable launching platform would fit the bill.

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Arioch
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Re: Automated torpedo defense

Post by Arioch »

The Loroi do use missile buses in the form of the armored blisters. The chief problem with using them in huge numbers is that torpedoes are expensive, single-use weapons. Nobody in this milieu, not even the Umiak, has the spare industrial capacity to deploy (or support) a billion torpedo blisters in a single system as a defensive measure.

The Loroi blisters are not reusable; after deploying its submunitions, the bus portion will also attempt to engage the target on its own for as long as it still has fuel. A reusable missile bus is better known as a "fighter." Whether it's manned or not is a secondary issue; if you want to have any chance of actually reusing a reusable vehicle, then you have to make it more survivable, and that makes it more expensive. And frankly, the idea of being in a resupply base, having a cloud of unmanned torpedoes coming back at you to refuel sounds more than a little bit unnerving.

The defensive battle stations deployed to protect a system are not static, and can move within the system as needed (at a reduced acceleration, usually <5G) to support the fleet action. These bases can't chase down enemy fleets, but they don't need to; they're built for defending planets and orbital assets. These bases are going to be your ideal missile platforms.

No matter what kind of defensive installations you choose, you really have to be careful to avoid overkill. You might be able to afford 3 or even 4 battle stations for a cost of 2 starships, but if you overspecialize in defenses that can't be moved from one system to another, the enemy can simply choose to attack somewhere else. I think you'd be lucky to get 10,000 torpedoes for the cost of one cruiser; the cost of a billion torpedoes could buy you a hundred thousand cruisers.

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