Well of Souls Forums

Velocity. Not acceleration.

Also have to remember that these causality breaking events don't just happen at relativistic velocities, they're just easier to conceptualize. ALL time is relative to the frame: time at sea level is different from time in Denver because of minute differences in gravity. Time at the equator is different from time at the north pole because of different velocities. Time for you is different than it is for the computer in front of you, just not enough to notice. Anything that travels faster than light side steps time. Anything side stepping time side steps cause.

on 'absolute rest frame' if C truly is a constant, and the fastest possible velocity in a given direction is C, then by definition you HAVE a absolute rest frame, at absolutely zero velocity....but since physics guys keep saying that it's a matter of perspective....can you out accelerate a photon by C? no you can't, ergo, there is a rest frame, it's just not easily measured.

Nemo wrote:Also have to remember that these causality breaking events don't just happen at relativistic velocities, they're just easier to conceptualize. ALL time is relative to the frame: time at sea level is different from time in Denver because of minute differences in gravity. Time at the equator is different from time at the north pole because of different velocities. Time for you is different than it is for the computer in front of you, just not enough to notice. Anything that travels faster than light side steps time. Anything side stepping time side steps cause.

nnn, no, not to my understanding, things either slow down or speed up, there is no sidestepping of causality

discord wrote:on 'absolute rest frame' if C truly is a constant, and the fastest possible velocity in a given direction is C, then by definition you HAVE a absolute rest frame, at absolutely zero velocity....but since physics guys keep saying that it's a matter of perspective....can you out accelerate a photon by C? no you can't, ergo, there is a rest frame, it's just not easily measured.

It's c, lower case. And the fastest possible velocity in all directions is always c, in all inertial frames. Measure the speed of light in all directions from here on Earth...c. Accelerate until you're flying away from Earth at 0.999c and repeat the measurements...it's still c, in all directions.

Cy83r wrote:nnn, no, not to my understanding, things either slow down or speed up, there is no sidestepping of causality

And your understanding has been shown to be incomplete. Preservation of causality requires that signals don't travel faster than c. Velocities larger than c are as nonsensical to the universe as velocities lower than zero. There's completely-theoretical particles that travel faster than c, but they are only made consistent with observations and theory by restricting their interactions with normal matter so they can't actually transmit information faster than c.

so they can't actually transmit information faster than c.

Which is functionally the same as not being faster than c anyway.

Mjolnir wrote:

discord wrote:on 'absolute rest frame' if C truly is a constant, and the fastest possible velocity in a given direction is C, then by definition you HAVE a absolute rest frame, at absolutely zero velocity....but since physics guys keep saying that it's a matter of perspective....can you out accelerate a photon by C? no you can't, ergo, there is a rest frame, it's just not easily measured.

It's c, lower case. And the fastest possible velocity in all directions is always c, in all inertial frames. Measure the speed of light in all directions from here on Earth...c. Accelerate until you're flying away from Earth at 0.999c and repeat the measurements...it's still c, in all directions.

That's precisely the understanding it I was talking about.

Cy83r wrote:nnn, no, not to my understanding, things either slow down or speed up, there is no sidestepping of causality

And your understanding has been shown to be incomplete. Preservation of causality requires that signals don't travel faster than c. Velocities larger than c are as nonsensical to the universe as velocities lower than zero. There's completely-theoretical particles that travel faster than c, but they are only made consistent with observations and theory by restricting their interactions with normal matter so they can't actually transmit information faster than c.

Shown, no; admitted, yes. I would expect you to know the difference between 'I don't understand' and 'You're right, I'm wrong'. Now let's forget this entire thing because I'm going to wind up committing bannable offenses if we continue.

Yeah, I think we should drop the physics angle as it's derailing the thread and braining my damage. I've been trying to wrap my damage around relativity since high school and it's been doing my head in trying to get a clear picture of how it works.

Cy83r wrote:
Also, you take Kendo classes? You win.

Heh, I suck actually, I'm still in the tutorial Kendoka classes, though we're starting to merge with the main group. The upperclassmen set a really brutal pace compared to what we're used to... though I guess that's to be expected when compared to us newbies. They might even entrust us with bogu someday!

Tangenitally on topic... I do wonder sometimes how certain Earth sports, martial arts in particular, would be viewed through Loroi eyes.

Especially Kendo... especially when the Kiai'ing starts up.

Yes, I have a vested interest

Razor One wrote:Tangenitally on topic... I do wonder sometimes how certain Earth sports, martial arts in particular, would be viewed through Loroi eyes.

Especially Kendo... especially when the Kiai'ing starts up.

Yes, I have a vested interest

Yeah, I'm wondering myself when the whole aspect of sanzai "conversing truth without words" and the human ideal of words of honor gets deeply discussed between Alexander and Still Storm, or maybe just he and Beyrl hash it out for exposition's sake.

The Japanese "martial arts," and Bushido itself, were all developed after the period in which the samurai actually fought wars. So, like most "martial arts," they have almost no military value. Some of them may have been useful for fighting duels, but even that is doubtful.

On the one hand, the Loroi also had peacetime periods where the warrior class probably had little better to do with their time than develop flowery "arts" fighting styles. But after 25 years of total war, I doubt such styles still receive much attention. So Loroi observers of Terran martial arts would probably view them with mixed reactions of nostalgia and amusement.

And then they see the evolution of Krav Maga.

A lot of martial arts are very practical, jiu jitsu, muay thai, and boxing in particular. Mixed martial arts certainly has done a lot to weed out the ones that are "showy," like capoeira and a lot of karate forms. Its actually been speculated that martial arts has advanced more in the past 20 years then in the previous 300. I can tell you from personal experience that two hours of jiu jitsu will dramatically improve your ground game.

I suggest "martial" arts return to core competencies. EG: Killing people and breaking their stuff. Until Jiu Jitsu katas and the like start incorporating hand guns, shot guns, and rifles into their routines I'll have a hard time seeing them as anything but flashy exercise. A real shame too, if you ask me. The emphasis they place on learning how to fall, proper balance and breathing, focus and discipline, etc. all mesh perfectly with firearms. Except the falling part... hopefully...

nemo: balance and falling techniques are probably the most useful things any martial arts class ever taught, those things save lives(or at least pain injury and indignity) on a regular basis, but it is mostly negative values so no one notices it.

and yes, most 'martial arts' have pretty much left the area of functional warfare behind, it's second tier abilities at best nowadays....but several schools teach disarming techniques against bladed and projectile weapons...i suppose that counts for something.

discord wrote:nemo: balance and falling techniques are probably the most useful things any martial arts class ever taught, those things save lives(or at least pain injury and indignity) on a regular basis, but it is mostly negative values so no one notices it.

and yes, most 'martial arts' have pretty much left the area of functional warfare behind, it's second tier abilities at best nowadays....but several schools teach disarming techniques against bladed and projectile weapons...i suppose that counts for something.

I pretty much agree with this, I used to attend a Koei-Kan karate dojo (apparently it's not technically karate because it came over originally from a Chinese artist) and the one thing I can still pull off without any bad form are my falls and those (plus the ingrained reaction) have saved me some major pain at least once when I was struck by a car while riding my bike. The bike took the entire beating (somehow had my leg away from the impact side before I even realized I was about to get hit) and got wedged in the front wheel well allowing myself to pop off and roll ahead of the car, my poor fall parka taking most of the abuse the road dished out.

I could never really throw a punch, but everything else they taught me has been fairly useful.

Arioch wrote:The Japanese "martial arts," and Bushido itself, were all developed after the period in which the samurai actually fought wars. So, like most "martial arts," they have almost no military value. Some of them may have been useful for fighting duels, but even that is doubtful.

Wouldn´t dismiss them this hard. Living next to a subpar part of Hamburg, i still profit from my Wing Tsun training 20 years ago. The basic rules still kick in when it comes to a confrontation (5 times in the last 8 years).
Without them or untrained it would have been even more unpleasant.

Arioch wrote:So Loroi observers of Terran martial arts would probably view them with mixed reactions of nostalgia and amusement.

Damn telecinetic Space Elves...

Trantor wrote: Damn telekinetic Space Elves...

yeah that one thought punch is murder ( especially in Fireblades case )

trantor: never said martial arts had NO value, just almost no military value, there is a difference.

and the biggest value old school marital arts has in a military scenario is discipline, focus and physical conditioning.

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oops, was not directed at me....my bad trantor.
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