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Pages 114, 115, 116 
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Post Re: Pages 114, 115, 116
It's a detail, next to Beryl's look on her face, I really like the Star Trek TOS 'SHRAK' sound of the door in #116..

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Fri Jun 02, 2017 12:47 pm
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Post Re: Pages 114, 115, 116
GabrielGABFonseca wrote:
fredgiblet wrote:
Spoiler: show
Image


Personally, I don't really like the idea of Outsider having too much emphasis on romance or - goddess forbid it - romcom elements. But then again... read my signature. :P

That would be incredibly funny in my opinion.


Fri Jun 02, 2017 1:44 pm
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Post Re: Pages 114, 115, 116
GabrielGABFonseca wrote:
fredgiblet wrote:
Spoiler: show
Image


Personally, I don't really like the idea of Outsider having too much emphasis on romance or - goddess forbid it - romcom elements. But then again... read my signature. :P


Space Harem adventure ahoy!

Barring that, Space Opera. Either way, Kirk Doctrine is in full effect.


Fri Jun 02, 2017 2:20 pm
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Post Re: Pages 114, 115, 116
Beryl really seems to have a look of suspicion on her face. And that Loroi very much have a similar custom to human women staking their claim, because she certainly did and that message was well received by Talon... why else would she feel the need to placate Beryl? After all, Beryl did berate Talon in sort of a roundabout way of doing something untoward. Beryl usually does voice her thoughts more carefully and would have chosen a more neutral tone (like, "that gesture looks unfamiliar to me, someone explain it?") if she had wanted to.

It could be for the sake of storytelling, but the fact that Beryl did speak out loud and not simply sent her misgivings to Talon (exchanged glances and Talon releasing his hand) could account very much to the "staking the claim" thing here.... To make it clear to both of them that other females should back off of him :)

Might be with males being a scarcity and access being regulated Loroi did sort of adopt a behavior like "get hold of one and don't let go", which might have been translated literally here... :)

Add to that, the customary greeting did get a bit off track and into a more personal space over the course of pg. 115, but it certainly does look like that Talon wouldn't mind. Had she minded, she might have answered with a mild rebuke and not offered her spoken name in return. :)

What I am sort of missing is any idea on Alex thoughts that she didn't seem to attempt to intrude on his thoughts. Either they were all briefed that it would be uncomfortable for Alex and whoever tries it, or she simply lacks the aptitude, which would be highly unusual for a species with telepathy as the preferred mode of communication. My bets are put on self-restraint on her part.


Sat Jun 03, 2017 9:43 pm
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Post Re: Pages 114, 115, 116
It could also be that he's a first-contact alien and whoever does the important work of establishing trust/communications/basic knowledge and so forth with him will have earned a lot of brownie-points or prestige in whatever passes the military hierarchy, either for beryl personally or for her caste. Or perhaps she is adamant that it should be her caste that controls interaction and establishment of common units and basic knowledge with the alien, which could explain why she seemed frustrated to see Tempo, who's part of the 'diplomatic' caste, join them on the trip.

Or maybe it's just me who's read too much C.J.Cherryh and trying to establish some kind of non-kirkian reason for her demeanor? ;)


Sun Jun 04, 2017 1:42 am
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Post Re: Pages 114, 115, 116
boldilocks wrote:
It could also be that he's a first-contact alien and whoever does the important work of establishing trust/communications/basic knowledge and so forth with him will have earned a lot of brownie-points or prestige in whatever passes the military hierarchy, either for beryl personally or for her caste. Or perhaps she is adamant that it should be her caste that controls interaction and establishment of common units and basic knowledge with the alien, which could explain why she seemed frustrated to see Tempo, who's part of the 'diplomatic' caste, join them on the trip.

Or maybe it's just me who's read too much C.J.Cherryh and trying to establish some kind of non-kirkian reason for her demeanor? ;)


Sure. Beryl's interest in him could be purely professional. But that wouldn't change the fact that she might want to reserve exclusive rights on him and could see Talon's supposed forwardness as a threat to them. So yes, for whatever reasons, Beryl seems to have a rather jealous streak. Towards Tempo, Talon and whoever else who might approach him.


Sun Jun 04, 2017 2:24 am
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Post Re: Pages 114, 115, 116
boldilocks wrote:
It could also be that he's a first-contact alien and whoever does the important work of establishing trust/communications/basic knowledge and so forth with him will have earned a lot of brownie-points or prestige in whatever passes the military hierarchy, either for beryl personally or for her caste. Or perhaps she is adamant that it should be her caste that controls interaction and establishment of common units and basic knowledge with the alien, which could explain why she seemed frustrated to see Tempo, who's part of the 'diplomatic' caste, join them on the trip.

Or maybe it's just me who's read too much C.J.Cherryh and trying to establish some kind of non-kirkian reason for her demeanor? ;)


She has the Xenophile quality. Although her sensitivity about her age might play into your explanation as well.


Sun Jun 04, 2017 2:54 am
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Post Re: Pages 114, 115, 116
Another thing - Beryl was fast asleep a moment ago, right? She dozed off as Tempo took over, but didn't take long to be up and about again. I'd peg it on warrior training, to be up and alert if something around oneself changes - like Alex getting up and moving away - but the first thing she did is to follow him and then seeing him in a rather compromising situation. Depends on how much Beryl heard in pg. 116, things could get awkward. (Take away Talon's first sentence and just read the second one and you may see what I mean :) )


Sun Jun 04, 2017 3:49 am
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Post Re: Pages 114, 115, 116
boldilocks wrote:
Or maybe it's just me who's read too much C.J.Cherryh and trying to establish some kind of non-kirkian reason for her demeanor? ;)


Glad I'm not the only one who read her books!


Sun Jun 04, 2017 5:57 am
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Post Re: Pages 114, 115, 116
I don't know about you people, but I don't think Beryl's "jealousness" comes from any romantic intention of hers... at least not yet.

I can see it happening in the near-to-mid term future, although I think it is less likely than a strictly professional and platonic attachment to Alex and vice-versa.

It's hard to guess, really. On one side, I personally think a romantic subplot would feel a tad strange in Outsider, but then again, it is a Space Opera, after all. And even in the "New Space Opera" sub-genre (Mass Effect, for instance) on which I believe Outsider falls into, it still is a predominant theme.

So really, who knows?

Well, Arioch does, but he ain't telling! :lol:

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Sun Jun 04, 2017 9:50 am
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Post Re: Pages 114, 115, 116
hi hi

If I recall, the Loroi tend view men as being in a different class all together, even when they're not strange aliens. I wouldn't be surprised if it was more along the lines of two people vying for the attention of an adorable puppy.


Sun Jun 04, 2017 10:17 am
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Post Re: Pages 114, 115, 116
One thing to remember is that Jordin is still a BIG unknown to the Lori. Beryl and Tempo may not believe is an artifact of the enemy this does not mean they can fully trust him. He has not telepathic presence which would normally mean he is a powerful telepath. The fact that he has kept it up under circumstances that would be imposable for a Lori to do does not mean he they fully believe he can’t use telepathy. So for that and other pragmatic reason they have to keep an eye on him.

So, as has been point out before, Beryl literally fell asleep on the job in front of an ambassador which would obviously be embarrassing and frustrating by itself. She then finds that in the short time he was not in the presence of his security detail or under observation by the diplomatic or science officer he comes in physical contact with a Lori. Given the advantages physical contact can give a telepath this represents a potentially significant security breach even if it was just a piolet that should have known better.

So there are some good purely professional reasons for to her be acting annoyed right now. Admittedly none of them are as amusing as Beryl simply being jelly. :)

It just might be a little early to say Jorden will be Caption Kirking his way throw this.


Sun Jun 04, 2017 11:53 am
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Post Re: Pages 114, 115, 116
Eh, let's be honest with ourselves: Jardin might have to play an anti-Kirk (not the goatee kind, either).


Sun Jun 04, 2017 9:46 pm
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Post Re: Pages 114, 115, 116
I still find it hilarious that certain words that Talon spoke were bolded and italicized for emphasis :p

"...Pilots have a Natural feeling for each other..."

"Your hand is really warm."

Beryl needed several trigger warnings walking into the sight of that "handshake" and hearing those words in those sentences.
:mrgreen:


Sun Jun 04, 2017 10:43 pm
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Post Re: Pages 114, 115, 116
Dirty Yasuki wrote:
I still find it hilarious that certain words that Talon spoke were bolded and italicized for emphasis :p

"...Pilots have a Natural feeling for each other..."

"Your hand is really warm."

Beryl needed several trigger warnings walking into the sight of that "handshake" and hearing those words in those sentences.
:mrgreen:


Just as I hinted to it elsewhere, take this sentences out of context (as it might have happened to Beryl the moment she entered) and it could really become quite dicey....


Mon Jun 05, 2017 11:01 am
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Post Re: Pages 114, 115, 116
novius wrote:
Dirty Yasuki wrote:
I still find it hilarious that certain words that Talon spoke were bolded and italicized for emphasis :p

"...Pilots have a Natural feeling for each other..."

"Your hand is really warm."

Beryl needed several trigger warnings walking into the sight of that "handshake" and hearing those words in those sentences.
:mrgreen:


Just as I hinted to it elsewhere, take this sentences out of context (as it might have happened to Beryl the moment she entered) and it could really become quite dicey....

i changed the highlighted elements a bit more.
Any pauses can be blamed on being unused to talk trade instead of using telepathy....

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Mon Jun 05, 2017 1:09 pm
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Post Re: Pages 114, 115, 116
novius wrote:
Another thing - Beryl was fast asleep a moment ago, right? She dozed off as Tempo took over, but didn't take long to be up and about again. I'd peg it on warrior training, to be up and alert if something around oneself changes - like Alex getting up and moving away - but the first thing she did is to follow him and then seeing him in a rather compromising situation. Depends on how much Beryl heard in pg. 116, things could get awkward. (Take away Talon's first sentence and just read the second one and you may see what I mean :) )

I was wondering myself if she was poked up and ordered to follow.

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Thu Jul 13, 2017 10:31 am
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Post Re: Pages 114, 115, 116
"Oh, for goodness sake, Talon, don't go grabbing its hand, how do you know it won't jump on your face and have intercourse with your mouth and put an egg in your stomach or something? Don't you watch any movies? I don't want to have some slimy thing pop out through your chest in the middle of the mess hall! See, THIS is why alien relations should be relegated entirely to the Listel caste, only our superior training and experience blah blah blah [this is where Talon starts tuning her out]"


There guys, I've put in the telepathy bits so you don't have to wonder about this any more.


Thu Jul 13, 2017 11:43 am
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Post Re: Pages 114, 115, 116
boldilocks wrote:
"Oh, for goodness sake, Talon, don't go grabbing its hand, how do you know it won't jump on your face and have intercourse with your mouth and put an egg in your stomach or something? Don't you watch any movies? I don't want to have some slimy thing pop out through your chest in the middle of the mess hall! See, THIS is why alien relations should be relegated entirely to the Listel caste, only our superior training and experience blah blah blah [this is where Talon starts tuning her out]"


There guys, I've put in the telepathy bits so you don't have to wonder about this any more.


:lol:


Fri Jul 14, 2017 4:49 am
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Post Re: Pages 114, 115, 116
Image


Sat Jul 15, 2017 8:37 am
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Post Re: Pages 114, 115, 116
I thought we established that the loroi sort of penis isn't elf-portable. :D

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Sat Jul 15, 2017 11:28 pm
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Post Re: Pages 114, 115, 116
Good Lord! I come back after a while away and so many pages!
Lovely work as always Arioch.

Reading through the comments and looking at the comics, I think to be honest all points are very valid!
We appear to have a quite complex interaction that at first seems to be a simple jealous exchange between Beryl and Talon over Talons actions with Alex (and I'm all for that!)

From my view point on Alex's behalf, the poor guys had virtually no friendly contact at all since being taken in by the Loroi, apart from of course the attentions of someone who's manic intensity he could consider similar to someone wanting to dissect his brain, (I'm looking at you here Beryl). So the seemingly genuine friendliness of Talon and her physical touch that she looked like she wanted to happen (without the psychic brain fiddling) could involuntarily draw Alex in closer emotionally, despite his diplomatic training, leading to the extended time the hand shake has taken and the barbed comment to Beryl about being handcuffed previously.

Pretty much all my views on the Loroi however, I will say now are pure conjecture on my part.

I am still of the opinion that the Loroi were originally created by a progenitor race the Soia, using stone age humans as the base stock, and that has led to certain 'artifact' emotions and responses like laughing aloud, and body language, something I notice Arioch has put a lot of thought into incorporating into the characters,.
So it is very possible that Beryl could be acting out of jealousy and Talon acting on attraction, however my original thought was to question this as Loroi are conditioned to share males which are controlled by a group for their purpose, so I don't see why Beryl could react from that form of jealousy.
However, depending on how men are protected by a group, it could be an involuntary reaction to another group, 'The Pilots' trying to take control of a male from her group, so she could be reacting in a broader sense of jealousy but on a Loroi subconscious level.
Or, Beryl is simply miffed that Alex is responding to Talon in ways he has not responded to her on a non romantic level, something a young scientist like her might react haughtily to.

Talon I think, is coming from the angle of a veteran that has put her life on he line many times and therefore might have a more relaxed view of interactions and genuinely does see Alex as a kindred spirit pilot, who has without reservation offered a hand of friendship and the trust of his first name (if only by accident), someone she can enjoy pilot related conversation with and give her a break from the Eternal Space Teen that is Spiral. I do not think there is any romantic interest there as they have literally only just started speaking, also, I do not think we have seen enough of Talon yet to make a call on what kind of person she is!

Another possibility is the presence of Alex has triggered a dormant competitive streak to other females when a single attractive male (albeit alien) is present, something that has not been seen in Loroi society due to Loroi males releasing some form of calming pheromone that allows them to juggle intimate relationships with several Loroi females at once. (I cannot see the Soia being cruel enough to not put something in place for the Loroi in this respect)
I do think the Loroi use pheromone and scent to mood alter their people somewhat after reading the 'slight smokey vanilla scent' the Command ship has which would be an extension of mood control pheromones the males have.

Of course, it could be a mix of all the above or none at all!
But one thing I do think is Tempo is deliberately engineering these situations to see what Loroi / Human interaction could be in the future, a sort of social experiment for her to devise the best course of action for future diplomatic (and spying) relations.


Sun Jul 16, 2017 7:05 am
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Post Re: Pages 114, 115, 116
harlequin2262 wrote:
Image


Frickin' Tenoin caste, guys. Can't leave them alone with a joystick shaped item for two minutes...


Mon Jul 17, 2017 4:57 am
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Post Re: Pages 114, 115, 116
boldilocks wrote:
harlequin2262 wrote:
Image


Frickin' Tenoin caste, guys. Can't leave them alone with a joystick shaped item for two minutes...


:lol: :lol: :lol:


Mon Jul 17, 2017 7:05 am
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Post Re: Pages 114, 115, 116
"Hey baby. I'm a PILOT."

Later, in the mess:

Talon: "Of course the alien male wished for me to grasp his hand! I am often requested to hold hands, with a great variety of exotic alien menfolk, such is my natural attractiveness and cosmopolitan appeal!".


Mon Jul 17, 2017 7:49 am
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