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Page 117: I will demonstrate!

Posted: Sun Jun 04, 2017 8:07 pm
by Krulle
Page 117: http://well-of-souls.com/outsider/outsider117.html is up!

Yes, Beryl is clearly pushing herself between Talon and Alexander....

Re: Page 117: I will demonstrate!

Posted: Sun Jun 04, 2017 8:42 pm
by CrimsonFALKE
There may be a few feelings on Beryl's side. I am not going to say that a bit of romantic tension is bad in the comic. My only question is not that this is a sign of jealousy but it is legally allowed for her to treat an officer like that? I know from my ROTC days we had regulations on our behavior sure it wasn't the military be we could shove each other around.

Re: Page 117: I will demonstrate!

Posted: Sun Jun 04, 2017 8:50 pm
by dragoongfa
CrimsonFALKE wrote:There may be a few feelings on Beryl's side. I am not going to say that a bit of romantic tension is bad in the comic. My only question is not that this is a sign of jealousy but it is legally allowed for her to treat an officer like that? I know from my ROTC days we had regulations on our behavior sure it wasn't the military be we could shove each other around.
Warrior Caste society and she IS in charge of 'taking good care of' (her words) the weird alien.

Re: Page 117: I will demonstrate!

Posted: Sun Jun 04, 2017 9:19 pm
by CrimsonFALKE
dragoongfa wrote:
CrimsonFALKE wrote:There may be a few feelings on Beryl's side. I am not going to say that a bit of romantic tension is bad in the comic. My only question is not that this is a sign of jealousy but it is legally allowed for her to treat an officer like that? I know from my ROTC days we had regulations on our behavior sure it wasn't the military be we could shove each other around.
Warrior Caste society and she IS in charge of 'taking good care of' (her words) the weird alien.
True enough Talon may have gotten alien cooties from holding his hand too long. Beryl saves the day!

Re: Page 117: I will demonstrate!

Posted: Sun Jun 04, 2017 9:26 pm
by icekatze
hi hi

My interpretation is that Beryl is stung because she thinks Alex is still mad at her because of the interrogation. She explained how it wasn't her fault, but it probably seems to her that Alex is holding a grudge, doesn't trust her, and is holding back cooperation and information with her as a result. Perhaps she feels like she might have lost her chance to make a good impression?

As for propriety in the Loroi society, I assumed that Tempo was speaking truthfully when she said that tact is a foreign concept to most Loroi. As long as no one is injured, they are probably allowed to be very direct in their interactions.

Re: Page 117: I will demonstrate!

Posted: Sun Jun 04, 2017 9:34 pm
by CrimsonFALKE
icekatze wrote:hi hi

My interpretation is that Beryl is stung because she thinks Alex is still mad at her because of the interrogation. She explained how it wasn't her fault, but it probably seems to her that Alex is holding a grudge, doesn't trust her, and is holding back cooperation and information with her as a result. Perhaps she feels like she might have lost her chance to make a good impression?

As for propriety in the Loroi society, I assumed that Tempo was speaking truthfully when she said that tact is a foreign concept to most Loroi. As long as no one is injured, they are probably allowed to be very direct in their interactions.
What about Jealousy how does that work out with the Loroi?

Re: Page 117: I will demonstrate!

Posted: Sun Jun 04, 2017 9:45 pm
by icekatze
hi hi

Perhaps when two Loroi have irreconcilable differences, the more senior of the two can tell the other to go take a hike.

I'm not sure if there are any circumstances where getting into a physical fight is allowed in the general populous. I recall Arioch saying that crime is usually punished very harshly, but on the other hand, it sounds like there was some amount of backstabbing involved when Greywind ascended to the throne.

Re: Page 117: I will demonstrate!

Posted: Sun Jun 04, 2017 9:59 pm
by CrimsonFALKE
icekatze wrote:hi hi

Perhaps when two Loroi have irreconcilable differences, the more senior of the two can tell the other to go take a hike.

I'm not sure if there are any circumstances where getting into a physical fight is allowed in the general populous. I recall Arioch saying that crime is usually punished very harshly, but on the other hand, it sounds like there was some amount of backstabbing involved when Greywind ascended to the throne.
Yes that is interesting although a warrior culture would be a harsh place ie Sparta. Although in Sparta certain personal issues could be worked out in a fight. Thanks for your helpful incite!

Re: Page 117: I will demonstrate!

Posted: Sun Jun 04, 2017 10:14 pm
by Kava
"Stop learning Humaniti customs... that's my job!"

Territorial Loroi.

Re: Page 117: I will demonstrate!

Posted: Sun Jun 04, 2017 11:45 pm
by harlequin2262
I love how nonplussed and derpfaced Talon looks in the last panel.
icekatze wrote: My interpretation is that
Or possibly she's hearing the thousand generations of nerdy, bookish, introverted Listel behind her screaming at her for missing her opportunity to partake in the Humanity Male Groping Greeting Practise.

Re: Page 117: I will demonstrate!

Posted: Mon Jun 05, 2017 12:57 am
by raistlin34
Kava wrote:"Stop learning Humaniti customs... that's my job!"

Territorial Loroi.
Mmm... maybe is not so far fetched. I wonder if their caste system is so strict that a Loroi can take offense when she feels a member of another caste is interfering or even performing her duties.

Re: Page 117: I will demonstrate!

Posted: Mon Jun 05, 2017 1:21 am
by wasp609
raistlin34 wrote:
Kava wrote:"Stop learning Humaniti customs... that's my job!"

Territorial Loroi.
Mmm... maybe is not so far fetched. I wonder if their caste system is so strict that a Loroi can take offense when she feels a member of another caste is interfering or even performing her duties.
Thats actually a possibility, ive seen that happen between teachers at my college a few time.

Re: Page 117: I will demonstrate!

Posted: Mon Jun 05, 2017 5:41 am
by novius
Yep, as I suspected. Beryl is sort of staking her claim. And I think both on professional and personal level. As a scientist she is a bit ticked that someone else got to learn of another interesting tidbit of alien culture beforehand, or poaching on her caste's prerogative, and on a personal level... Well, she did show often enough that she had little regard for his personal space, which is rather unusual for Loroi.

Maybe I'm reading too much into it, but had someone noticed Talon saying "alien menfolk" instead of, say, "alien males" in pg. 112? That would clearly denote a difference on how they view humans. And that would just be Talon, sort of a run-of-the-mill Loroi rather than Beryl.

Secondly, break in continuity? Tempo sort of handed off Alex to Talon for her to give him access to the starmaps (see pg. 111), and now it requires Beryl to access them? Either it is a plot hole or another sort of a demonstration on Beryl's side giving Talon a signal to back off and not intrude on what she perceives is her own domain.

Re: Page 117: I will demonstrate!

Posted: Mon Jun 05, 2017 5:48 am
by silverhawk100
There's also the fact that the Loroi's telepathy is stronger through physical contact. While it doesn't work on humans, catching two people touching each other socially implies they are exchanging more than simple information.

Re: Page 117: I will demonstrate!

Posted: Mon Jun 05, 2017 5:51 am
by novius
silverhawk100 wrote:There's also the fact that the Loroi's telepathy is stronger through physical contact. While it doesn't work on humans, catching two people touching each other socially implies they are exchanging more than simple information.
Yep, that situation was quite loaded in both human and Loroi customs. And still is. Though.... Alex did mention that Talon didn't intrude upon his mind. But that's something Beryl wouldn't know.

Re: Page 117: I will demonstrate!

Posted: Mon Jun 05, 2017 6:27 am
by novius
icekatze wrote:hi hi

My interpretation is that Beryl is stung because she thinks Alex is still mad at her because of the interrogation. She explained how it wasn't her fault, but it probably seems to her that Alex is holding a grudge, doesn't trust her, and is holding back cooperation and information with her as a result. Perhaps she feels like she might have lost her chance to make a good impression?

As for propriety in the Loroi society, I assumed that Tempo was speaking truthfully when she said that tact is a foreign concept to most Loroi. As long as no one is injured, they are probably allowed to be very direct in their interactions.
Whenever there is a rigid societal structure or protocol has to be followed, every deviation from it is attributed a meaning, and many of them do convey some sort of meaning. Just look at meetings between high-ranked politicians. The order how they meet and greet, exchange handshakes, and so on and so forth, almost everything is attributed some hidden message, and in many cases rightly so.

I think while Loroi telepathy makes it difficult for them to lie and hide intentions and therefore being straightforward has become their social mores their caste structure would be the cause for devloping a wider set of nonverbal interaction, wider in comparison to human nonverbal interaction, which does already comprise the majority of interpersonal communication.

So yes, I do think Loroi would attribute much more to miniscule things like the order of greeting, things regular humans would find rather inconsequential.

On a more personal note, Beryl is quick to ask for apology on her own or even on her species' behalf. I do agree with the view that she may feel the need to make up for lost ground, maybe even more on a personal level, since she does show a rather bubbly, upbeat personality and would like for people to get along fine.

Yeah... hurting Beryl's feelings would feel like kicking a puppy. :)

Re: Page 117: I will demonstrate!

Posted: Mon Jun 05, 2017 7:00 am
by dapple26
Jealous Beryl is so cute. :D

Re: Page 117: I will demonstrate!

Posted: Mon Jun 05, 2017 9:02 am
by Mr Bojangles
What an excellent surprise! Very glad to you've been able to devote some time your comic, Arioch.

To the comics themselves, I have to say the facial expressions are top-notch. Beryl's shock, indignation and skepticism were quite plain. Talon's final expression on 117 is hilarious - *does not appreciate interruption of humanity greeting custom!*

And, I find myself leaning towards the personal/professional jealousy theory for Beryl. Alex is her alien, dammit!

Re: Page 117: I will demonstrate!

Posted: Mon Jun 05, 2017 1:19 pm
by novius
Mr Bojangles wrote:And, I find myself leaning towards the personal/professional jealousy theory for Beryl. Alex is her alien, dammit!
And another long-standing question had been answered, Loroi (females) don't readily share their toys, too. :mrgreen:

Re: Page 117: I will demonstrate!

Posted: Mon Jun 05, 2017 2:23 pm
by cacambo43
novius wrote: Secondly, break in continuity? Tempo sort of handed off Alex to Talon for her to give him access to the starmaps (see pg. 111), and now it requires Beryl to access them? Either it is a plot hole or another sort of a demonstration on Beryl's side giving Talon a signal to back off and not intrude on what she perceives is her own domain.
Good catch. It seems a bit odd that Beryl would be taking this over (per page 118) from a pilot, who you'd think is the better navigator? Then again, Beryl's encyclopedic knowledge and eidetic memory may trump that.

CJSF