How humanity can affect the war, by turning the moon into a deathstar.

[White]

It seems rather clear that the strategic location Humanity holds is their big advantage.

The only problem is how to use it.

The current discussion seems mired in the fact that Humanity would basically be turning their territory into a warzone. More keely, they'd be turning it into a warzone that neither they, nor their prospective allies the Loroi would be able to adequately defend.

Rather, I think it would be more clear to say that the Loroi would have little incentive to put a thousand ships there to defend the infrastructure as long as the jump point exists.

So, it seems like humanity will have to use some rather unorthodox tactics.

So, we come to the death-star idea.

Loroi pulse cannons out-range their Umaik counterparts by a fair amount. The long range versions can hit a target on the moon from earth orbit according to the weapon's charts.

Pulse cannons are also very practical weapons, requiring little in the way of ammunition other than energy.

Humans have energy, and a moon!

Now, imagine you outfitted the moon with dozens of clusters of pulse cannons. Each cluster would have thousands of pulse cannons, powered by a static power-station and cooling networks, maintained by Loroi engineers with the help of local infrastructure.

Conservatively, you could have something with a thousand times the spread, a hundred times the power, and ten times the range of a ship board cannon.

And, if things go well, you could have something with a thousand times the spread, a thousand times the power and a thousand times the distance of a ship board cannon. (IE. This could take out a ship at mars orbit and vaporize anything closer.)

Litter the surface with point defences, and you'd have a fortress!

The only question of feasibility would be the one about Loroi industrial capacity to supply the weapons.

I think they'd be able to supply the needed weaponry. My arguments are indirect, but, I think they're convincing. Here they are.

During the fall of Seren, the union managed an "incomplete" evacuation of the planet, leaving it with fifty million inhabitants by the time the Umaik took the system.

So, if we say they managed to get 100 million people out of the system in one month, and that the average ship can carry a thousand people, and thirty percent of union traffic was diverted to the evacuation, and that the average ship needed five days before it could return to Seren to pick up another batch of civilians, then ((100,000,000/1000)/5) * 3 gives us an outfit of twenty thousand ships for the union.

So, taking that, along with the "thousands" of ship losses that the loroi were able to continually replenish over nine years, and assuming a retirement age of fifty years for the average civilian ship. We can assume that the union has the capacity to build around 4000 ships a year.

So, what does this tell us about the Union's ability to build pulse cannons? Well, nothing really, but it does, I think, paint a favorable picture. That is, to say, if anything other than the pulse cannon is the bottleneck for Loroi ship production, then they should be able to supply the needed weapons trivially... at least, once they ramp the appropriate industries up. I don't imagine Loroi are making pulse cannons that don't have ships to go with them.

And, now that we have our pulse cannon equipped death-star, what would be the tactical utility?

Well, how about complete invincibility! That enough for ya?

Mind, it wouldn't be able to defend the entire system, but it would be able to keep Earth, and any associated infrastructure, safe from Umaik attack. And it could do so indefinitely.

Well, actually, a caveat to that previous statement. The moon would have a ~2 degree blind spot in the form of the earth. So, a defence fleet would still be necessary. However, the moon's ability to deny the other 258 degrees as well as to support the defense fleets would be helpful. Not to mention, the needed defense fleet would be far smaller than other-wise would be the case.

And, what about the political feasability?

Well, for one, the death-star would make greater Loroi investment in earth more appealing, as it would reduce the operating expences of defending the place. (Note, operating expences are what matter if the Loroi start crumbling and growing desperate to cut costs.) And, once they've set up the appropriate, and deeply necessary infrastructure, it just makes it all the more necessary to defend.

Of course, there's the fact that the Loroi would have to share their most advanced weapon, but, hey, they're facing a genocidal enemy.

Not to mention, this requires Union production to set up, and a union fleet to complete, so it would be vaguely non-threatening enough for the Loroi to invest in. The historians have better pulse cannons anyway, so what's the harm in sharing?

And, if it comes to it, I'm sure the Union could ask that only Loroi engineers be allowed to interact with the weapons. And, really, I'm sure humans would agree to such restrictions, following them to the letter. Nope, they absolutely will not exploit the fact that Loroi intelligence doctrines are designed around the assumption that they can read their opponent's minds.

Ok, fine, it'll be a bit of an issue, but not too troubling.

Sure, the Americans are somehow going to weaponize it despite the fact that's already a weapon, and the Chinese will be making cheaper versions within fifty microseconds of having laid eyes on it, but frankly, I'd still gear Loroi hesitance to such technology transfers as low, considering the circumstances.

[spacewhale]

I imagine it'd be the equivalent to installing battleship guns on an island in Fiji. Daunting I'm sure, but you can't really force a fleet to go to Fiji.

[Mk_C]

Well, how about complete invincibility! That enough for ya?

I dunno man. Moon kinda can't maneuver to evade mass driver fire. Anyone can send slugs at 'er from the other end of the system if they feel like it, and if the aim was good - she'll end up taking all that near-relativistic goodness up her every crater with no opportunity to do anything about it.

Well, actually, a caveat to that previous statement. The moon would have a ~2 degree blind spot in the form of the earth. So, a defence fleet would still be necessary. However, the moon's ability to deny the other 258 degrees as well as to support the defense fleets would be helpful. Not to mention, the needed defense fleet would be far smaller than other-wise would be the case.

Unless the enemy actually bothers to use said blind spot and approach the Earth under the cover of, well, Earth.

The solution to those downsides is pretty obvious, really. We just need to put enough Teidar into selenocentric orbit so that they could use PK to push the damn rock around enough to significantly alter it's orbit, giving it maneuvering capabilities. Only have to make sure they don't untether or crash it into the Earth as they do. Can't be too hard.

[Ithekro]

An approach to Earth and odds of evading the Moon's defense grid would heavily rely on where in its orbit the Moon is verses where the likely jump exit points are in the Sol System, which are likely somewhere around the orbital distances between Jupiter and Saturn, and in the directions of the nearest stars. Because once they jump in system, assuming the sensors are in place, everyone in the Sol System will know they have arrived within the limits of the detection equipment's distance from the entry points and the communications speeds. After that its just a matter of how long it takes for the invaders to reach Earth, and if the Moon is in a positions to fire. But unless there is a mobile force, in system, an enemy can, within the limits of their propulsion technology and maybe orbital mechanics, choose where they want to strike Earth from, and how.


However, Earth could get away with using lower tech versions of Loroi systems for a defense fleet. They don't need to be super fast, just fast enough to operate as a force of mobile weapons platforms. And they need not be armed with the best the Loroi have....just a lot of weapons that are effective against enemy ships at combat ranges. They also need strong shields. The earth force will not be the striking arm of the war, but if designed right, it could be effective enough to free up Loroi units that would otherwise need to defend Earth, and instead free those units for a second front offensive from Earth's region of space.

Basically the equivalent of an American Standard Battleship in space terms, as oppose to the Loroi's British Battlecruisers and American Fast Battleships in space terms. ( A Space Battleship Yamato might help as well, but that's a different matter). Relatively slow battle wagons with lots of guns, and not even the largest guns...just lots of them. While being reasonably protected, if not over protected to compensate for their lack of speed. If Earth's space is relatively safe, the Earth defensive battleships could be sent to backup Loroi offensives, providing firepower to systems to again free up the faster units for continuing the push deeper into enemy space.

[White]

I imagine it'd be the equivalent to installing battleship guns on an island in Fiji. Daunting I'm sure, but you can't really force a fleet to go to Fiji.

Like I said, this isn't meant to force the Umaik to go to Fiji, or earth.

It's meant to keep them away from earth.[

quote=Mk_C post_id=38319 time=1596526254 user_id=7061]

Well, how about complete invincibility! That enough for ya?

I dunno man. Moon kinda can't maneuver to evade mass driver fire. Anyone can send slugs at 'er from the other end of the system if they feel like it, and if the aim was good - she'll end up taking all that near-relativistic goodness up her every crater with no opportunity to do anything about it.

Yes, and that would force the Umaik to install mass drivers onto their ships, weakening their forces and forcing them to invest in niche technology that will be at a disadvantage should it ever meet with the small Loroi fleet that's posted around the moon. Also, I wonder whether they have the ship technology to send something substantial at relativistic speeds, and how accurate their aim would be.

And, if they do commit to using mass drivers... Well, hit the projectiles with a waveloom and hope it's "effects on matter" do the job.

Well, actually, a caveat to that previous statement. The moon would have a ~2 degree blind spot in the form of the earth. So, a defence fleet would still be necessary. However, the moon's ability to deny the other 258 degrees as well as to support the defense fleets would be helpful. Not to mention, the needed defense fleet would be far smaller than other-wise would be the case.

Unless the enemy actually bothers to use said blind spot and approach the Earth under the cover of, well, Earth.

The solution to those downsides is pretty obvious, really. We just need to put enough Teidar into selenocentric orbit so that they could use PK to push the damn rock around enough to significantly alter it's orbit, giving it maneuvering capabilities. Only have to make sure they don't untether or crash it into the Earth as they do. Can't be too hard.

If we go for the fun numbers, this thing could take out something that's beyond mars orbit. At that distance, a two degree blind spot becomes something it can quite sufficiently aim around. (Depending on the plane of approach of it's targets.)

More notably, though, it would coral the approaching ships onto a known trajectory, and (for the first few incusrsions) would allow you to destroy some rather large Umaik fleets assuming they're not expecting it.)

Also

[spacewhale]

Like I said, this isn't meant to force the Umaik to go to Fiji, or earth.

It's meant to keep them away from earth.

Sure, but you generally want to put weapon systems where they will be put to good use, Earth in this setting is about as remote as can be, thus the comparison to Fiji. Earth would be about as much strategic value as capturing a Mennonite colony as far as the technological gap goes, something to be mopped up later after an immediate threat is eliminated.

[Arioch]

For starters, humanity doesn't have any pulse cannons. Humanity doesn't currently have an alliance with the Loroi, but even if they did, the Loroi don't have tens of thousands of pulse cannons lying around. Weapons are among the most expensive parts of a warship, and the Loroi are building warships for themselves pretty much as fast as they can.

But let's suppose that somehow humanity did get their hands on tens of thousands of pulse cannons. They'd be better off installing them on ships that can maneuver instead of installing them on a moon that can simply be avoided.



Pulse cannons can just barely reach the Moon from GEO, but this is outside their effective range. Pulse cannons based on the Moon can't cover Earth. All the enemy has to do is approach Earth from the other side, and stay in a lower orbit, and the weapons on the Moon can't touch them.

Even if weapons based on the Moon could cover the approaches to Earth, the weapons would be just as vulnerable to attack as those based on ships; but worse, the Moon cannot dodge. Kinetic attacks such as mass drivers or kinetic-kill missiles, which would be useless against a maneuvering ship, would be quite effective against fixed ground targets. Point defense fire has limited effectiveness against kinetic attacks; even if you hit the projectile, it's still going to hit you (though it may be off target). A high velocity KKV has the kinetic energy of a nuclear explosion; near misses will still do the job.

I think there will be defensive ground bases with short-range defensive weapons to protect ground assets from cheap attach, but it doesn't make a lot of sense to put large numbers of offensive weapons in a ground base, especially one like the Moon that the enemy can simply avoid. You'd be much better off installing them in mobile vessels that can take the fight to where the enemy is.

[Ithekro]

Since the Earth does have an early version of "blaster" technology (Mjolnir Cannon), it would be reasonable to assume that if they are giving specifications of extending particle beam ranges, Earth could build their own variants of the Loroi/Delrias style blasters for a new combat fleet. Maybe a hybrid of some kind that keeps some of the Mjolnir's punch but extends the maximum range out to maybe 200 Mm. Effective range would still probably be no more than 60Mm, and would likely be considered a slightly underpowered variant of the Mk 4. in terms of close in firepower, but the drop off around 60Mm would be at least slightly more powerful than the Mk 2., with the Earth weapon's range drop off rapidly after that. That and of course improved laser weaponry to engage Umiak missiles.

Earth ships would need shielding of some time to manage "modern" ship to ship combat. As well as the internal dampeners to allow for at least 18G - 24G acceleration on their combat starships.

These improvements would keep them within tolerances against Umiak units. They wouldn't be equal in any way, but they could at least put up a fight. Especially if they can manage to over arm their ships, managing a large power plant, but without the acceleration properties, allowing the extra power to be used for to weapons and cooling system.

[StarCruiser]

Keep in mind that power generation also implies more cooling required.

Anything that produces power, or uses power, or transfers power (minus perfect superconductors) produces waste heat. Thermodynamics will not be ignored...

[Arioch]

Of course humanity can improve their technology over time, especially if they have help, but this takes time.

[White]

For starters, humanity doesn't have any pulse cannons. Humanity doesn't currently have an alliance with the Loroi, but even if they did, the Loroi don't have tens of thousands of pulse cannons lying around. Weapons are among the most expensive parts of a warship, and the Loroi are building warships for themselves pretty much as fast as they can.

Well, I wasn't assuming they had tens of thousands of pulse cannons lying around. I was saying that, given their apparant production capabilities, and assuming that weapons production was not a bottle-neck in ship production, they ought to be able to expand the relevant indusries enough to - over the course of several months - supply the needed weapons.

Of course, this is an assumption based on conjecture. But, I don't think it's as completely unfounded as "they have thousands of weapons lying around."

But let's suppose that somehow humanity did get their hands on tens of thousands of pulse cannons. They'd be better off installing them on ships that can maneuver instead of installing them on a moon that can simply be avoided.



Pulse cannons can just barely reach the Moon from GEO, but this is outside their effective range. Pulse cannons based on the Moon can't cover Earth. All the enemy has to do is approach Earth from the other side, and stay in a lower orbit, and the weapons on the Moon can't touch them.

Well, what is the cause of the range limit? According to the illustration, it seems like it's because the beam dissipates into an ineffective cone as it travels out. If you clustered them by the thousands, the respective beams would overlap as they dissipated, increasing the effective range.

Naively, this would extend the range to mars orbit if you had a thousand clustered together. But, for my more conservative estimate, I went for a ten times range extension. Although, the power and breadth would still be a thousand times greater.

Even if weapons based on the Moon could cover the approaches to Earth, the weapons would be just as vulnerable to attack as those based on ships; but worse, the Moon cannot dodge. Kinetic attacks such as mass drivers or kinetic-kill missiles, which would be useless against a maneuvering ship, would be quite effective against fixed ground targets. Point defense fire has limited effectiveness against kinetic attacks; even if you hit the projectile, it's still going to hit you (though it may be off target). A high velocity KKV has the kinetic energy of a nuclear explosion; near misses will still do the job.

This is why I said a small loroi fleet would still be necessary. Of course, you won't be able to deny the Umaik the system with this, but that's not it's purpose. If the solar system is a strategic location, then having something to defend the support infrastructure the Loroi will put in earth orbit seems rational.

I think there will be defensive ground bases with short-range defensive weapons to protect ground assets from cheap attach, but it doesn't make a lot of sense to put large numbers of offensive weapons in a ground base, especially one like the Moon that the enemy can simply avoid. You'd be much better off installing them in mobile vessels that can take the fight to where the enemy is.

And, in doing so, the moon station would serve it's purpose of weakening the Umaik by making them adapt to such considerations. The point of the infrastructure is to lower the size of the Loroi fleet neccesary to protect earth. I imagine the fleet would have an easier time taking on an Umaik fleet that had to dedicate some amount of resources to mass drivers.

Also, I'm not sure mass drivers would be an instant kill if you could deflect them. If you place your clusters strategically (in craters, for example,) then a near miss would, in a vaccum, I think not pose too much of an issue. Or at least not damage it to irreparability, especially if power generation and the like were placed underground.

The point of the moon idea wasn't to replecate fleet capabilities. It was to use the lunar infrastructure and size in order to power a higher density of blasters than would be practicable on the limited capabilities of a single ship. (Cooling, power and the like would be more easily gotten on the moon.)

Of course, if the weapons turn out to be too expensive, as you said, then it's a moot point. But, given that assumption was in the air when I did my analysis, I'm not sure the idea is as impossible as it might seem at first glance.

[White]

Like I said, this isn't meant to force the Umaik to go to Fiji, or earth.

It's meant to keep them away from earth.

Sure, but you generally want to put weapon systems where they will be put to good use, Earth in this setting is about as remote as can be, thus the comparison to Fiji. Earth would be about as much strategic value as capturing a Mennonite colony as far as the technological gap goes, something to be mopped up later after an immediate threat is eliminated.

From the insider page on the war, it seems as if the location of Earth will be highly relevant for both parties, opening up a doorway to their enemies' flank.

[Zorg56]

Why specifically moon?

I think that idea generaly can be effectively used by creating large space stations near the jump points in sol system.
Main concern in TL9 v TL 10 here is range and i think that problem can be overcome by going really big stations with ridiculously giant laser canons as main caliber.
Sure it is absurdly ineffective, but i dont see how any amount conventional TL9 fleet can make difference if the enemy can just dodge anything you throw at them while oneshoting your ships from any distance.
With large installations you can make some use of earth industrial capacity and almost guarantee defeat of small force that will likely be sent to the sol system.

[Arioch]

Well, I wasn't assuming they had tens of thousands of pulse cannons lying around. I was saying that, given their apparant production capabilities, and assuming that weapons production was not a bottle-neck in ship production, they ought to be able to expand the relevant indusries enough to - over the course of several months - supply the needed weapons.

Of course, this is an assumption based on conjecture. But, I don't think it's as completely unfounded as "they have thousands of weapons lying around."

There is always a "long pole in the tent" when it comes to building any system, which is the bottleneck to production. I'm sure the engines are also very expensive and difficult to produce, but the Loroi have been producing these engines for a long time. The pulse cannons, however, are a technology at the absolute limit of Loroi production capability, a technology that is still not much more than 10 years old for the Loroi, and so while the pulse cannon might not be the longest pole in the tent of warship production, it's still in the top 5. Ten thousand pulse cannons is the requisite production for 1,250 Vanguard-class battlecruisers. The Loroi do not have 1,250 Vanguard battlecruisers, but they would certainly like to have them. It seems very unlikely that a military state in a desperate shortage of ships and materiel would be willing to divert this kind of production to a new ally. It would be cheaper for them to send several hundred ships to defend human territory, which would be far more effective than a fixed moon base.

...ignoring the fact that humanity and the Loroi are not currently allies.

Well, what is the cause of the range limit? According to the illustration, it seems like it's because the beam dissipates into an ineffective cone as it travels out. If you clustered them by the thousands, the respective beams would overlap as they dissipated, increasing the effective range.

Naively, this would extend the range to mars orbit if you had a thousand clustered together. But, for my more conservative estimate, I went for a ten times range extension. Although, the power and breadth would still be a thousand times greater.

Clustering plasma weapons doesn't extend their range. The plasma focus and plasma cannon shunt high-energy, high-velocity plasma down a carrier wave towards the target; without this confining field, the like-charged plasma particles repel each other and cause the plasma to dissipate quickly. Today's plasma weapons (shaped-charged weapons) have a very short range of effect: a few meters at most from the point of plasma release. In Outsider weapons, the range of plasma weapons is limted by the ability of the carrier wave to keep the beam tight. Electromagnetic screens are very capable at deflecting charged particles; they can only be overloaded and penetrated if the plasma source is concentrated. Once the effective range of the carrier wave is exceeded, the plasma rapidly disperses, and is not dangerous to a target with electromagnetic shielding.

If this were not the case, and multiple mounts did extend plasma weapon range, then the Umiak should have been able to negate their range disadvantage by stacking weapons long ago.

And, in doing so, the moon station would serve it's purpose of weakening the Umaik by making them adapt to such considerations. The point of the infrastructure is to lower the size of the Loroi fleet neccesary to protect earth. I imagine the fleet would have an easier time taking on an Umaik fleet that had to dedicate some amount of resources to mass drivers.

The Moon station would never touch the invading Umiak, who could bombard and even invade Earth without ever coming within range of Moon-based pulse cannons.

Plasma weapons don't work very well through atmosphere, so they're not effective defensive weapons for an inhabited planet. They can be effective from ground bases on an airless moon, but this doesn't do you any good if that moon is out of the range of the target you're trying to protect.

Also, I'm not sure mass drivers would be an instant kill if you could deflect them. If you place your clusters strategically (in craters, for example,) then a near miss would, in a vaccum, I think not pose too much of an issue. Or at least not damage it to irreparability, especially if power generation and the like were placed underground.

The Umiak can sit outside the 1 LS range of Moon-based pulse cannons and bombard them with kinetic weapons for any amount of time required. Not that they actually need to do so, since the defenses on the Moon can be safely and completely ignored.

In order to fire, the weapons must be in the surface and therefore exposed to enemy fire. It doesn't matter very much if you power generation still works when all of your surface weapons have been destroyed.

A moonbase armed with tens of thousands of pulse cannons would be more expensive than a Loroi fleet of several hundred ships, and it would be completely useless against any enemy smart enough to stay outside 1 LS range. It is not a practical of resources. Even if the humans did ally with the Loroi, and they were stupid enough to request such a thing, the Loroi would surely refuse.

[Mk_C]

Today's plasma weapons (shaped-charged weapons) have a very short range of effect: a few meters at most from the point of plasma release.

Shaped charge weapons utilize plasma?

In Outsider weapons, the range of plasma weapons is limted by the ability of the carrier wave to keep the beam tight. Once that range is exceeded, the plasma rapidly disperses, and is not dangerous to a target with electromagnetic shielding.

Come to think of it - why wouldn't carrier wave emitters scale indefinitely in effective range with their power? Other than it inviting Freudian-tier weapons gigantomania and lame-ass space battles as a consequence, of course.

[Arioch]

Today's plasma weapons (shaped-charged weapons) have a very short range of effect: a few meters at most from the point of plasma release.

Shaped charge weapons utilize plasma?

As I understand it, current shaped charge weapons use the energy of the explosive to vaporize a material (usually a metal) and project it in a focused jet to penetrate armor. This jet does not depend on heat or charge to penetrate the target; it's done through sheer kinetic energy. But as I understand it, such energies turn the vapor into plasma.

Come to think of it - why wouldn't carrier wave emitters scale indefinitely in effective range with their power? Other than it inviting Freudian-tier weapons gigantomania and lame-ass space battles as a consequence, of course.

Well, I'm not a physicist, but it seems to me that if lasers have a limited range based on the properties of photons to diverge over distance, then it also seems logical to me that any electromagnetic wave that you're using to corral your plasma beam will have a limited range as well, since photons are the force carrier for electromagnetism.

(The high-level answer to that question is: if beam weapons had unlimited range, that would throw a serious kink into the tactical equation.)

[Mk_C]

As I understand it, current shaped charge weapons use the energy of the explosive to vaporize a material (usually a metal) and project it in a focused beam to penetrate armor.

As I understand it, the penetration stream's temperature is typically way below the material's melting point - it's shaped almost entirely through mechanical deformation by the explosion. It's essentially a completely regular solid body, lacking any properties of plasma or gas - it just happens to interact with (somewhat slower and somewhat faster) parts of itself and any stationary target at velocities significantly above the speed of sound in the material of both the stream itself and the target. Structural rigidity becomes a dank meme in such collisions, as both bodies behave approximately as perfect fluids, going through one another faster than deformation waves can spread. Eh, pointless pedantry.

Well, I'm not a physicist, but it seems to me that if lasers have a limited range based on the properties of photons to diverge over distance, then it also seems logical to me that any electromagnetic wave that you're using to corral your plasma beam will have a limited range as well, since photons are the force carrier for electromagnetism.

That would be true for any distances, including incredibly short ones. Yet this hypothetical tech allows for focused and stable carrier waves reaching LS distances already, which implies that we can mitigate photon divergence through some exotic wave modulation and sheer energy. Which begs the question - why wouldn't a 10 times bigger emitter with a 100 times more energy give us a carrier wave that remains stable enough to focus plasma at ranges at least several times longer? It invites the assumption that started this thread - that a pulse cannon the size of the Moon would reach beyond Mars' orbit. Range extension wouldn't have to be unlimited - just provide an opportunity to trade range superiority for size and energy requirements incompatible with sensible space vessel mounts, even if it comes with declining efficiency. This is the root of the idea, even if it eventually starts stumbling over things like lack of maneuverability.

(The high-level answer to that question is: if beam weapons had unlimited range, that would throw a serious kink into the tactical equation.)

Obviously. That sort of interstellar warfare can be cool in it's own way, but it would definitely do away with most of the navy-like cozyness of battleships, captains, fleet maneuvers and the like.

[Krulle]

Earth shadow is gigantic from a viewpoint of a moving ship.
If the ship is manoeuvrable enough to do interplanetary travels, it's a piece of cake to stay in Earth's shadow forever.

It does not matter how well armed the moon is, if you can simply sail around it.
The Fiji analogy fits.


and I don't think Earth is a real strategic asset, when the region is devoid of large mineral deposits.
To defend Earth, it sounds like you need to carry in more resources than you can draw out (besides a population that is not yet tired of war efforts, and thus much more motivatable than your own).
Also, staging an attack on a flank has always been a major logistic difficulty, even in Roman/Carthagian times. Often it was cheaper and more promising to use the same ressources and go head-on with full force, instead of diverting a part of the ressources away from the main force.
And in space, where logistics are infinitely more complex that would be a showstopper, except for suicide runs (read: besides the initial fuelling and supplying no refuel nor resupply once the mission started) which are intended to draw defensive powers away from the main gate you wish to attack. And whether Earth would be happy by either side to lure a large defensive/retaliatory force towards Human space is questionable.
(Imagine either party to stage an attack from the direction of Earth. If that force gets repelled, a retaliatory force to scout out if any bases have been missed in that direction is likely to be staged, and if they find Earth, good bye any semblance of independence. And I don't think either party has an interest to defend Earth with a force strong enough to defend it against any retaliatory force, when the same ships could reinforce the attack in the first place, and thus make it more likely to succeed.)


Also, using wave carriers parallel next to each other will increase the dissipation, as it's even more unlikely to keep the waves in a pattern that they don't disturb each other.
Ever heard of how waves can cancel each other out?
Any plasma would at those places dissipate ....

No, you'd need only one focal element per beam, anything else will cause a decrease in efficiency, and thus in range, of the carrier wave / plasma corralling wave.

[jterlecki]

If humanity and the loroi allied, what would be the most potent weapon humans could create short term (with a small loroi nudge)? Humans are usually good at creating weapons (with war being present throughout our recorded history).

[Arioch]

If humanity and the loroi allied, what would be the most potent weapon humans could create short term (with a small loroi nudge)? Humans are usually good at creating weapons (with war being present throughout our recorded history).

Depends on what you mean by "short term." If you mean less than a year, Terran vessels could be equipped with up to date torpedoes, and ships with sufficient power generation might be jerry-rigged with defensive screens. That's about it, and these would have to be supplied by the ally. Even updates to the Mjolnir would probably take more than a year.

As others have mentioned, new technology means you have to build the tools that make the machines that make the systems, all to new tolerances. Even if you get the prototype system right on the first go, it still requires a whole new generation of procedures and factories to actually produce it in quantity. To quote St. Elon:

"The difficulty and value of manufacturing is underappreciated. It's relatively easy to make a prototype but extremely difficult to mass manufacture a vehicle reliably at scale. Even for rocket science, it's probably a factor of 10 harder to design a manufacturing system for a rocket than to design the rocket. For cars it's maybe 100 times harder to design the manufacturing system than the car itself."