The Current State of Human Technology

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Paragon
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The Current State of Human Technology

Post by Paragon »

Hey, everybody.

So I've been wondering about the specifics on how far technology has come by the events of Outsider's prologue. How much have computers changed? Materials science? Manufacturing techniques? What about robotics and cybernetics? Genetic engineering? Do we have combat exoskeletons like future versions of XOS 1 and 2?
"Optical computers, genetic catalogs, nanorepair modules--forget all of that. It's when you see a megaton of steel suspended over your head by a thread the thickness of a human hair that you really find God in technology."

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Arioch
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Re: The Current State of Human Technology

Post by Arioch »

Since this is a story focused around alien cultures and technology, I have dealt as little as possible with changes to future human society, so that the reader can see Alex as much as possible as a familiar figure from a familiar culture. No doubt technology will change people's lives in the next 150 years, but that's not really the subject of the story. Human technology level is at TL9 on the GURPS scale.

I think probably the most dramatic impact on human culture in the near future will be the advances in medical technology. Gene therapy will greatly extend lives (which is why I have Earth's population so high; I believe there are people alive today who will still be alive in 2160). Genetic engineering for humans will probably be outlawed in most Earth nations for some time to come, so it will move offworld to the colonies.

Computer technology will continue to advance, but I don't think Ghost in the Shell style cyber interfaces will be practical in the near future (as discussed in a different thread), so there's only so much cool graphical interfaces can do to absorb us into the computere world. AI will advance, but I don't think our engineers are dumb enough to let it take over.

Physical sciences and manufacturing probably won't have changed that much. Energy will still be hard to store compactly and turn into kinetic energy efficiently. "Nanobots" are, I believe, both beyond near-term technology as well as being extremely dangerous and hard to control.

I don't think combat exoskeletons or powered armor are practical in the short term, but I expect combat robots to be very viable.

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Grayhome
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Re: The Current State of Human Technology

Post by Grayhome »

I want to apologize to everyone in advance for this.

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NOMAD
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Re: The Current State of Human Technology

Post by NOMAD »

Grayhome wrote:I want to apologize to everyone in advance for this.

Image
hopely, he won't be back :lol:
Arioch wrote:

"Nanobots" are, I believe, both beyond near-term technology as well as being extremely dangerous and hard to control.
what about nano-materials, I would have to assume that humans would have advance those beyond the their current applications.
Arioch wrote:
I don't think combat exoskeletons or powered armor are practical in the short term, but I expect combat robots to be very viable.
like this guy

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I am a wander, going from place to place without a home I am a NOMAD

Paragon
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Re: The Current State of Human Technology

Post by Paragon »

I see I'm not the only one here who likes the new Deus Ex.

I'm surprised we haven't developed new or stronger materials by 2160, and I'd think most standardized equipment and products would be manufactured by robots by that point. Just consider how far we've come technologically since 1850. It's certainly make ship building and repair easier! Ah well, such is the space opera future.

I guess my curiosity about this stems from the discussions in the some other threads about what humans would be capable of building and contributing to the war in the short and long term which would inform and have some (at least tangential) effects on Alex's negotiating decisions. What Humans can bring to the Loroi Union table, if you will.
"Optical computers, genetic catalogs, nanorepair modules--forget all of that. It's when you see a megaton of steel suspended over your head by a thread the thickness of a human hair that you really find God in technology."

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Arioch
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Re: The Current State of Human Technology

Post by Arioch »

Paragon wrote:I'm surprised we haven't developed new or stronger materials by 2160, and I'd think most standardized equipment and products would be manufactured by robots by that point. Just consider how far we've come technologically since 1850. It's certainly make ship building and repair easier! Ah well, such is the space opera future.

I guess my curiosity about this stems from the discussions in the some other threads about what humans would be capable of building and contributing to the war in the short and long term which would inform and have some (at least tangential) effects on Alex's negotiating decisions. What Humans can bring to the Loroi Union table, if you will.
Certainly we'll have better materials 150 years from now than we have today. I just don't predict any "scrith" type game-changing super materials in the near term. Advances will be evolutionary. And many products today are manufactured by robots; it's an economic rather than a revolutionary development.

Humanity is more than a full tech level behind the Loroi and Umiak (who are both on the border between TL10 and TL11). Humanity does not possess any special technologies that the Loroi or Umiak have not yet seen. That's kind of the whole point of the setting: Humanity does not have some natural superiority that makes them instant masters of the universe. If that were the case, all Alex would have to do is show up and present his "we win" card. I don't think that makes for a very compelling story.

Alex does potentially have a trump card -- Humanity appears to possess some kind of telepathic immunity. But that can work against Humanity as easily as it can work for them, from the Loroi point of view. Alex's mission is to somehow secure Humanity's survival, through his own limited means in the situation in which he finds himself. That's what the story is about.

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Cy83r
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Re: The Current State of Human Technology

Post by Cy83r »

As far as materials tech goes, we /might/ be able to produce something like crystallized transparent aluminum (I believe it is called sapphire?) and we already have electromagnetic molds in the prototype phase for advanced ceramics (or metals apparently, my bad) if not already widespread.

Advanced smart fabrics and sensor-embedded fabrics could be highly plausible in a century and a half. Not to mention potentially drastic reductions in the size and energy requirements for processors and related electronics. The Terran colonies may well be swimming in a virtual sea of information, even more so than we already are.

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Trantor
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Re: The Current State of Human Technology

Post by Trantor »

Arioch wrote:Alex does potentially have a trump card -- Humanity appears to possess some kind of telepathic immunity. But that can work against Humanity as easily as it can work for them, from the Loroi point of view.
In all these years i haven´t figured out how this could work FOR/be welcome by the Loroi.
I rather think this is our trumpcard with the other parties in this "forced-marriage" union.
sapere aude.

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Mjolnir
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Re: The Current State of Human Technology

Post by Mjolnir »

Arioch wrote:"Nanobots" are, I believe, both beyond near-term technology as well as being extremely dangerous and hard to control.
Probably more like "horribly fragile and expensive to actually do anything with". Nanotech engineered to be vastly more efficient than life is also likely to be far more brittle when outside the environment it was designed for. Redundancy and adaptability will not only be harder to design, but also reduce efficiency and replication speed. And building things from the molecular level up is just generally going to be one of the slowest and least energy efficient approaches possible. Not dangerous, just very limited in application...more like highly customizable supercatalysts than molecular constructors.

Arioch wrote:I don't think combat exoskeletons or powered armor are practical in the short term, but I expect combat robots to be very viable.
Combat engineering exoskeletons seem relatively plausible. Operate tethered to an engineering vehicle for power, replace tires/wheels/tracks and deploy bridges in the field, set up equipment and defenses at base, etc. However, you have to ask why the controller has to be in the machine rather than in relative safety in the truck...an exoskeleton is always going to be bulkier/less capable than something that doesn't have to fit around a human body.

There's probably some kind of specialty equipment we can make that would be of value to the Loroi. Sensor technology...we'll probably have had thermal sensors just short of the physical limits in detector sensitivity for quite a while by that point, radar/lidar systems might be similarly on par with what they have...on the receiving side, anyway, they might put a good deal more power into their long range active sensors. Some work to integrate with Loroi systems and we can go into full production. We might have a few things the Loroi haven't come up with due to their relative lack of interest in basic research, but they have existing allies that cover the same gaps.

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Grayhome
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Re: The Current State of Human Technology

Post by Grayhome »

I've been looking through a few gurps books and from this I've extrapolated that at T9 Humanity has access to Warhammer 40k Imperial Guard tech (owch) with possibly some simple Battlesuits and Battleoids. They will have some gene therapy technology though...

Alpha (TL9) 39 points
Careful eugenic improvements ensure an attractive, athletic, healthy individual. Medscanning may reveal minor “mutations” compared to the human norm, such as being born without an appendix. This is a simple Homo superior genotype that TL9+ parents – or societies – might select for their children.
Attribute Modifiers: DX+1 [20]; HT +1 [10].
Advantages: Attractive [4]; Longevity [2]; Resistant to Disease (+3) [3]. Features: Taboo Traits (Genetic Defects, Mental Instability). Availability: $64,000. LC4.
Sub-Races: Omega (+28 points): An enhanced version of the Alpha, designed to be both beautiful and intelligent; increase appearance to Handsome [12] and add IQ+1 [20]. $92,000. LC3.


^(Alex may be one of these.)^

Orion (TL9) 70 points
These genetic upgrades were engineered with slight metabolic and glandular modifications designed to burn away excess fat, enhance physical performance, and optimize their crisis response. They are good “super-soldier” candidates, but might be created by anyone who wants a highly athletic variant race.
Attribute Modifiers: ST+1 [10]; DX+1 [20]; HT+1 [10].
Advantages: Appearance (Attractive) [4]; Combat Reflexes [15]; Fearlessness 1 [2]; Fit [5]; High Pain Threshold[10]. Disadvantages: Overconfidence (12) [-5]. Quirks: Attentive [-1]. Features: Taboo Traits (Genetic Defects, Mental Instability).
Availability: $95,000. LC4.


The Mental Instability worries me, and as the Hierarchy and Imperium are both at T10/11 they will have access to far more advanced augmentation technology for their soldiers then does Humanity. Growing super soldiers is going to become a situation born of necessity and morals be damned, Humans do not have the luxury of choice in the given scenario as a the average non-augmented human soldier cannot stand up to the equivalent Loroi/Umiak counterpart and survive from the data I've been seeing.

I've been examining Psionic technology as well and it appears that there are a number of devices available at T8/9 that would be very dangerous for the Loroi and make our combat troops effective against everything from their basic troopers to the highly trained warriors. I'm talking scenarios where capturing a telepath of Fireblade's caliber was a very possible goal, especially if they underestimated their male opponents.

The only chance I see is that the Imperium/Hierarchy will be overconfident and underestimate Humanity and give us a window to strike back. Other than that slim hope their current level of technological sophistication means they will roll over humanity as easily as they did the Orgus.

Goodness but I love this story!

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Grayhome
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Re: The Current State of Human Technology

Post by Grayhome »

It'll basically be like Imperial Guard vs Chaos Space Marines.

LegioCI
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Re: The Current State of Human Technology

Post by LegioCI »

Are there any areas of expertise where Terrans rival or even surpass their Loroi and Umiak rivals,(Biotech, Medicine, AI, Information/Communication Technology, etc?) or are we pretty much behind in everything?
"But notice how the Human thinks. 'Interesting... how can I use this as a weapon?'" - Arioch

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Re: The Current State of Human Technology

Post by Karst45 »

NOMAD wrote: what about nano-materials, I would have to assume that humans would have advance those beyond the their current applications.
Well currently we have nano-materials the transition was so smooth we didn't even notice it.

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Grayhome
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Re: The Current State of Human Technology

Post by Grayhome »

Based upon the theme that I believe Arioch is writing into this story, our technology will not be more advanced but we will have things neither the Hierarchy nor the Imperium have ever seen before and will desperately want. These technological innovations will stem from our democratic society and free thinking, creative spirit.

I'm thinking planetary screen generators, planetary gravity generators, planetary weather controllers, stealth armor for ships, first generation psionic as well as anti-psionic gear built into helmets/body armor, exotic and expensive things like that the other factions will want to purchase. Humans as the plucky, determined gadget race is what I'm reading here.

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Re: The Current State of Human Technology

Post by bunnyboy »

Grayhome wrote:I'm thinking
exotic and expensive things like that the other factions will want to purchase. Humans as the plucky, determined gadget race
I'm thinking plastic buzzing intimate handheld recreational devices. After we have sold those for unhappy umiak and loroi soldiers to make their lives less miserable, the war just dies out, when they are too busy having fun themselves.
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Grayhome
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Re: The Current State of Human Technology

Post by Grayhome »

In Gurps there is a psionic headband called an Empathic Mirror that amplifies and projects user's physical sensations to any other sentient life form within 5 yards... it's fairly low on the tech tree at T10. There is also a dream sculpting machine at TL 9 that allows multiple users to participate in the same dream, both of these devices seem useful for... recreational purposes.

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Trantor
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Re: The Current State of Human Technology

Post by Trantor »

Grayhome wrote:...stealth armor for ships...
Image

scnr.

Grayhome wrote:...but we will have things ... the Imperium ... will desperately want.
And what´s the most urgent shortage which WE have ubiquitous?
SpoilerShow
Men.


scnr, 2.
sapere aude.

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Grayhome
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Re: The Current State of Human Technology

Post by Grayhome »

Arioch has already stated that while there is no magical cloaking technology that turns a ship into the equivalent of a World War II submarine, there will be stealth technology in the Outsider-verse.

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Ktrain
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Re: The Current State of Human Technology

Post by Ktrain »

Grayhome wrote:Based upon the theme that I believe Arioch is writing into this story, our technology will not be more advanced but we will have things neither the Hierarchy nor the Imperium have ever seen before and will desperately want. These technological innovations will stem from our democratic society and free thinking, creative spirit.
That implies that neither belligerent has encountered similar societies to humanity. Arioch has stated that some capitalist ideas were adopted from Barsum and Neridi, though the Loroi state (or superstate) is pervasive. So there are some parallel concepts which have developed independently. Though, I still cannot fathom how half of a society's population can be part of the armed forces and still be economically competitive/vibrant (1/4 of N. Korea's men are enlisted and observe the tradeoffs).

Furthermore, the idea that the way humanity organizes is society is somehow unique has not really been elaborated much upon in the cannon. There will certainly be some elements which we have derived from our unique Terran environment which make be of use to either warring party (biological compounds/chemicals derived from or mimicking natural phenomena).
bunnyboy wrote: I'm thinking plastic buzzing intimate handheld recreational devices. After we have sold those for unhappy umiak and loroi soldiers to make their lives less miserable, the war just dies out, when they are too busy having fun themselves.
Do Umiak even have orifices for that? :o
OUTSIDER UPDATE => HALF LIFE 3 CONFIRMED?

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Count Casimir
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Re: The Current State of Human Technology

Post by Count Casimir »

Ktrain wrote: Do Umiak even have orifices for that? :o
I'm sure they can build some.
Arioch wrote:If that were the case, all Alex would have to do is show up and present his "we win" card. I don't think that makes for a very compelling story.
Maybe not a compelling story, but it'd be pretty funny.
Ashrain is best rain.

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