BattleRaptor wrote:However you stated from Theory to practice.. and theory to practice is a HELL of alot diffrent from working version and copying it.
I stated no such thing, I in fact have repeatedly mentioned things that we have working in labs, yet are years or decades from commercial implementation. You're talking about copying something given only a working model, without any theoretical understanding or industrial capabilities for producing the needed materials and parts.
BattleRaptor wrote:ANY bronze age Civilization could create a electric motor if given current day working permamanget version.
Infact they could even mass produce it for the standards of the time.
Would it be far less efficent due to uneven copper wire, the copper being less impure and having higher resistance.
The Rare Earth Magnets being poorly formed.
Yes yes yes and yes...
They'd be utterly baffled by rare earth magnets, which require exotic materials and processing to produce not just the right alloy but the right crystalline structures, and additional processing to permanently magnetize them. Permanent magnets were quite weak iron and natural magnetite things for most of the history of their use, it took alnico and ceramics to make them useful in motors and other electromechanical devices, and bronze age man couldn't even produce iron magnets. Even during the Renaissance we couldn't produce plain old alnico, lacking the ability to produce the needed aluminum even if we could identify it as being needed. Without any theoretical grounding in electricity and electromagnetism, it's anyone's guess how long it'd be before they figured out they needed insulated wire, worked out a way to insulate it without adding too much bulk, discovered it needed to be wound in the right direction and hooked up to brushes and commutators to connect them in the right order and polarity to an outside electrical power source...which they will also have to come up with.
And no, they could not mass produce them. Copper was used for expensive tools and jewelry, and they didn't have iron. The best they're likely to achieve is a crude toy.
BattleRaptor wrote:Given a working Umiak or Loroi ship, Terran ships would in short order start incorporating technogly from the alien ship in a relative short time a couple of years at most.
Could they create it at a quality equal to the orginal.
HIGHLY UNLIKELY.
Could they mass produce it on a level to match the Umiak or Loroi..
NO
Could they copy everything...
NO, some things would require further advances.
Exactly.
BattleRaptor wrote:You have effectively made the claim that Humans cant copy it untill we are at a equal level of advancement.
No, I haven't. My claim that this:
Voitan wrote:It only takes one peice of stolen or gifted tech, and within the year, crack it, and just two more, chugging them out like crazy, on top of whatever unconventional ideas that had already been mulled over for decades/centuries but had not the technology to implement them.
...is a wildly unrealistic description of what humanity can be expected to achieve. My claim is that some things will require extensive industrial foundations before we can even start to produce them, and that having a working example doesn't trump lack of theoretical understanding or industrial capabilities.
A more likely scenario would be us buying up outdated Loroi manufacturing equipment, spacecraft, what goes for written engineering literature among the Loroi, etc and attempting to retrace their industrial development at an accelerated pace while relying on them for materials we can't make and components we can't yet build. It's a matter of drastically upgrading and expanding our industry, not of copying a few gadgets. Some pieces of technology will be adapted within a year or so, but these will be the exception, not the rule. Much of the early advancement would probably actually be stuff we were already designing, but couldn't build until we got our hands on some used Loroi manufacturing equipment. None of this will be enough for us to make any immediate difference in the war, and the way it's currently going there won't be time for us to catch up.
BattleRaptor wrote:Well After the use of Japans mini subs during ww2, other countries tried to copy them... with little success.
Is this because of Japans skill at production?
no.. japan was ACTUALLY at a ww1 tech level.
Infact if japan had provided templates USA/Germany could have started mass producing them instantly.
THE problem wasnt the Tech level, it was actually designing it.
The problem was actually designing it, because the technology was identical to that already in use. Again, you're comparing with a situation that's nothing like the one that exists in Outsider.
Your "recurved bow" analogy was ridiculously disconnected from the situation in the comic, but led to a better one: give a Mongolian bowsmith a carbon fiber compound bow and see how long it takes him to replicate it. He wouldn't stand a chance of replicating the materials. He might manage to construct a compound bow out of materials he has, but it'd be heavy and hopelessly complicated to mass produce as a replacement for typical Mongolian recurved bows. He'd be completely unable to replicate the lightweight, accurate, mechanically-efficient bow he was given, until he got access to carbon fiber, composite resins, the manufacturing processes required to work with them, etc.
The speed difference can be seen as when humans later makes constantly small uppgrades to make it cheaper & better.
