Reply to topic  [ 99 posts ]  Go to page Previous  1, 2, 3, 4  Next
Loroi Trade translation request general 
Author Message
User avatar

Joined: Thu Sep 29, 2011 9:28 pm
Posts: 657
Location: Central Florida
Post Re: Loroi Trade translation request general
Anyone? Bueller?

e: Also, would it be possible to get a Trade grammar and dictionary at some point? :3

_________________
Hoenn


Thu Dec 20, 2012 11:27 pm
Profile WWW
Site Admin
User avatar

Joined: Fri Mar 04, 2011 9:19 pm
Posts: 2308
Location: San Jose, CA
Post Re: Loroi Trade translation request general
Sorry. There is a grammar guide here, and the current dictionary is here. The dictionary is missing a lot of words, but I don't have time to update it right now.

Quote:
Attention! The door from away stand.

toi-lal! sallit ronnei tanzi penzero.

Quote:
Your computer to be cycled is required. Until (it) deactivates (the) power button press, subsequently (the) power button again press.

lozen mestaladi to digeladeri ledareri. lashri darei lollas ranzet to binaniro, pabi lollas ranzet to bozil binaniro.

Count Casimir wrote:
It does remind me to ask--are E sounds more often long or short in LT?

Short. There's a pronunciation guide here.

_________________
Outsider


Fri Dec 21, 2012 1:34 am
Profile WWW
User avatar

Joined: Thu Sep 29, 2011 9:28 pm
Posts: 657
Location: Central Florida
Post Re: Loroi Trade translation request general
I personally find it fascinating how similar the grammars of Trade and Japanese are. :P

And I meant more like a proper reference grammar — maybe I could write one? :3

_________________
Hoenn


Fri Dec 21, 2012 1:54 am
Profile WWW
Site Admin
User avatar

Joined: Fri Mar 04, 2011 9:19 pm
Posts: 2308
Location: San Jose, CA
Post Re: Loroi Trade translation request general
Not sure what you mean by a "proper reference grammar."

_________________
Outsider


Fri Dec 21, 2012 2:21 am
Profile WWW
User avatar

Joined: Thu Sep 29, 2011 9:28 pm
Posts: 657
Location: Central Florida
Post Re: Loroi Trade translation request general
What is a reference grammar? The SIL says it's "a prose-like description of the major grammatical constructions in a language, illustrated with examples." It's basically a paper outlining a language's phonology, morphology, grammar, and syntax in detail.

_________________
Hoenn


Fri Dec 21, 2012 3:28 am
Profile WWW
User avatar

Joined: Thu Sep 29, 2011 9:28 pm
Posts: 657
Location: Central Florida
Post Re: Loroi Trade translation request general
What does a circle represent in the Loroi script (as about halfway down loroi_script.gif)?

_________________
Hoenn


Fri Dec 21, 2012 11:15 pm
Profile WWW
Site Admin
User avatar

Joined: Fri Mar 04, 2011 9:19 pm
Posts: 2308
Location: San Jose, CA
Post Re: Loroi Trade translation request general
CJ Miller wrote:
What does a circle represent in the Loroi script (as about halfway down loroi_script.gif)?

If my memory is correct, it was supposed to represent shorthand for a repeated vowel, so in this case for tonirrir it represented the second "i". I've given up on that idea.

_________________
Outsider


Fri Dec 21, 2012 11:56 pm
Profile WWW
User avatar

Joined: Thu Sep 29, 2011 9:28 pm
Posts: 657
Location: Central Florida
Post Re: Loroi Trade translation request general
And how do I type an accented vowel (e.g. mé) or a repeated-letter caron in the fonts you provided on page 1?

_________________
Hoenn


Sat Dec 22, 2012 12:02 am
Profile WWW
Site Admin
User avatar

Joined: Fri Mar 04, 2011 9:19 pm
Posts: 2308
Location: San Jose, CA
Post Re: Loroi Trade translation request general
The fonts don't include any special characters or punctuation.

The accents on the vowels in some the romanized texts aren't don't require any special marks in the Trade script; Trades vowels are very regular. I was just trying to indicate that me and to and a should be pronounced "may" and "tow" and "ah" rather than "mee" and "too" and "ei" as an English speaker is probably wont to do. But I'm probably just confusing people.

_________________
Outsider


Sat Dec 22, 2012 10:03 am
Profile WWW
User avatar

Joined: Thu Sep 29, 2011 9:28 pm
Posts: 657
Location: Central Florida
Post Re: Loroi Trade translation request general
You ought to provide IPA for pronounciation too :3

Also how do I form plurals? The only suggestion I see is adding -er to the 2PS pronoun to make it 2PP.

_________________
Hoenn


Sat Dec 22, 2012 12:53 pm
Profile WWW
Site Admin
User avatar

Joined: Fri Mar 04, 2011 9:19 pm
Posts: 2308
Location: San Jose, CA
Post Re: Loroi Trade translation request general
There's no difference between singular and plural nouns. One Soroin, two Soroin.

_________________
Outsider


Sat Dec 22, 2012 1:22 pm
Profile WWW
User avatar

Joined: Thu Sep 29, 2011 9:28 pm
Posts: 657
Location: Central Florida
Post Re: Loroi Trade translation request general
Oh. Alright then.

_________________
Hoenn


Sat Dec 22, 2012 5:13 pm
Profile WWW
User avatar

Joined: Thu Sep 29, 2011 9:28 pm
Posts: 657
Location: Central Florida
Post Re: Loroi Trade translation request general
What are the names of the Loroi Trade letters?

Do any Loroi sub/cultures use numerals or something approaching them?

What letter, if any, would Loroi use as a wildcard (as we use x, &c.)?

Also, do you have an IM account? because I'm contemplating translating some Magic: the Gathering cards into Trade and would verymuch like to get more timely answers to my questions about the Loroi languages :3

_________________
Hoenn


Sun Dec 23, 2012 6:05 pm
Profile WWW
Site Admin
User avatar

Joined: Fri Mar 04, 2011 9:19 pm
Posts: 2308
Location: San Jose, CA
Post Re: Loroi Trade translation request general
Trade really isn't at the point where you can do lots of translation without there being gaps. I can fill in gaps as needed for my own purposes, but obviously that's not something I have time to do on-demand for everyone that asks. I doubt Trade will ever be at the point where it will be as complete as something like Tolkien's Elvish languages; that level of detail can take a lifetime to assemble, and I don't have any such ambitions for Trade. It's just a list of Loroi words that got out of hand.

When I can I'll update the lexicon with more words from my own list, which may help some with the gaps, but that takes a lot of effort, and when it's been several months since the last new comic page, I think most people would rather have my efforts focused elsewhere.

I don't have names for the letters.

The Loroi use letters for numerals. It's possible that various subcultures or technical specialties use different systems, but that's not the kind of detail I can realistically supply.

Mainstream Loroi don't speak in mathematical jargon. If they needed to refer to a wildcard, they would use a pronoun (mezi he/she/it), or refer to the object in question as a "thing" (milol).

I'll answer questions here as best I can, and if I forget to answer for a long time, you can drop me an email, but I don't generally give out my private IM or phone information on the internet.

_________________
Outsider


Mon Dec 24, 2012 10:56 am
Profile WWW
User avatar

Joined: Thu Sep 29, 2011 9:28 pm
Posts: 657
Location: Central Florida
Post Re: Loroi Trade translation request general
Arioch wrote:
Mainstream Loroi don't speak in mathematical jargon. If they needed to refer to a wildcard, they would use a pronoun (mezi he/she/it), or refer to the object in question as a "thing" (milol).


That would make Loroi MTG cards... not as awkwardly worded as I thought*. Where the English one says, for example, "Target creature gets +X/+X until end of turn, where X is the number of creatures you control." would instead say "Target creature gets +1/+1 until end of turn for each creature you control."

* One exception is Target creature gets +X/+X until end of turn, where X is Auriok Bladewarden's power. I can't think of a way to word it in Trade that wouldn't be awkward like "Target creature gains power and toughness equal to Auriok Bladewarden's power until end of turn".

In that vein, what symbols if any do the Loroi use to represent addition and subtraction?

_________________
Hoenn


Last edited by Hālian on Mon Dec 24, 2012 8:39 pm, edited 1 time in total.



Mon Dec 24, 2012 5:54 pm
Profile WWW
Site Admin
User avatar

Joined: Fri Mar 04, 2011 9:19 pm
Posts: 2308
Location: San Jose, CA
Post Re: Loroi Trade translation request general
CJ Miller wrote:
One exception is Target creature gets +X/+X until end of turn, where X is Auriok Bladewarden's power. I can't think of a way to word it in Trade that wouldn't be awkward like "Target creature gains power and toughness equal to Auriok Bladewarden's power".

Is that awkward? Sounds perfectly clear to me, and isn't any longer than the +X/+X version.

CJ Miller wrote:
In that vein, what symbols if any do the Loroi use to represent addition and subtraction?

Again, the Loroi don't write in mathematical shorthand, so they would just write out the words for add (v. derre; n. "addition" derred), subtract (v. bizipi), etc.

_________________
Outsider


Mon Dec 24, 2012 6:52 pm
Profile WWW

Joined: Thu Mar 24, 2011 12:44 am
Posts: 600
Location: Umeå, Sweden
Post Re: Loroi Trade translation request general
side note, i feel sorry for Loroi mathematicians.


Tue Dec 25, 2012 6:05 am
Profile
User avatar

Joined: Sat Mar 05, 2011 2:21 pm
Posts: 458
Location: Finland
Post Re: Loroi Trade translation request general
discord wrote:
side note, i feel sorry for Loroi mathematicians.

As there are different requirements, they may have developed their own logi-linguistic way to write their thoughts.
Image
How does this resemble at all normal writing?

_________________
Supporter of forum RPG


Tue Dec 25, 2012 6:28 am
Profile

Joined: Thu Mar 24, 2011 12:44 am
Posts: 600
Location: Umeå, Sweden
Post Re: Loroi Trade translation request general
bunny: that's just it, that is mathematics, it is a language of it's own....the loroi however are stuck with what resembles roman numerals in base eight, they don't even have a flipping 'zero', just the concept of nothing, written as 'nothing', that just does not fly well in math.

doing anything much more complicated than 1+1 is a pain in the behind using the loroi system, example.
ZP addition MP equals
or
10+16=
at this level of simplicity it gets that long, do you think the loroi equivalent of V=hwl gets shorter, since they do not have a specialized math symbols/language for even the basic addition/subtraction? and this is simply the formula for figuring out the volume of a box,
actually i think it would go something like.
volume equals height times width times length.
V=hwl

general relativity? i feel so sorry for loroi mathematicians.


Tue Dec 25, 2012 7:11 am
Profile
Site Admin
User avatar

Joined: Fri Mar 04, 2011 9:19 pm
Posts: 2308
Location: San Jose, CA
Post Re: Loroi Trade translation request general
No doubt Loroi mathematicians have arcane jargon for their own purposes, but it is not mainstream to the culture the way algebra is for us.

Actually I think it's impressive that such things are mainstream in our culture especially given how loudly most people profess to be ignorant about math. If you describe a simple equation (such as that on the MtG card in question) in terms of X and Y, the vast majority of people will understand exactly what you mean.

_________________
Outsider


Tue Dec 25, 2012 9:29 am
Profile WWW

Joined: Fri Dec 21, 2012 4:11 am
Posts: 210
Location: Sweden
Post Re: Loroi Trade translation request general
Quick questions.

First: Is our math unique to us or are there other races with similar mathmatics.

Second: If ours is unique are the other races stuck with the aggravating loroi system (seriously i tried to do simple equations with the damn thing and after 23 seconds i felt like commiting genocide).

_________________
If nothing else works, a total pig-headed unwillingness to look facts in the face will see us through. General C.H Melchett commander of some unknown british regiment in the western front.


Tue Dec 25, 2012 1:05 pm
Profile
Site Admin
User avatar

Joined: Fri Mar 04, 2011 9:19 pm
Posts: 2308
Location: San Jose, CA
Post Re: Loroi Trade translation request general
Mathematical concepts are universal, but each civilization may have different kinds of notation and numerical systems to represent them. Some may be easier or harder to use than others, but it seems to me that once you have developed computer tools, ease of use is really not that big a deal.

_________________
Outsider


Tue Dec 25, 2012 1:49 pm
Profile WWW
User avatar

Joined: Fri Mar 02, 2012 6:12 pm
Posts: 273
Post Re: Loroi Trade translation request general
Arioch wrote:
Mathematical concepts are universal, but each civilization may have different kinds of notation and numerical systems to represent them. Some may be easier or harder to use than others, but it seems to me that once you have developed computer tools, ease of use is really not that big a deal.


Once they were developed, sure, but I wouldn't want to be the one who developed those computer tools using the Loroi numerical system...


Tue Dec 25, 2012 10:18 pm
Profile

Joined: Tue Dec 11, 2012 1:46 am
Posts: 122
Location: Czech Rep., European Union
Post Re: Loroi Trade translation request general
Arioch wrote:
The words in the lexicon on the webpage are a small subset (~470) of my master list, which is a spreadsheet with about 3,400 entries. Most were automatically generated by software according to the pronunciation rules of Trade, and assigned to a list.


May I ask what software, if it's not a secret?


Wed Dec 26, 2012 3:44 am
Profile
User avatar

Joined: Mon Mar 21, 2011 11:31 am
Posts: 581
Post Re: Loroi Trade translation request general
Victor_D wrote:
May I ask what software, if it's not a secret?


Check the bottom line of this thread. :geek:

_________________
Image


Wed Dec 26, 2012 6:45 am
Profile
Display posts from previous:  Sort by  
Reply to topic   [ 99 posts ]  Go to page Previous  1, 2, 3, 4  Next

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 4 guests


You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum

Search for:
Jump to:  
Powered by phpBB © 2000, 2002, 2005, 2007 phpBB Group.
Designed by STSoftware for PTF.