The "Real Aerospace" Thread

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RedDwarfIV
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Re: The "Real Aerospace" Thread

Post by RedDwarfIV »

Oddly, for a series so based in the Space Is An Ocean trope, spacecraft from the Honor Harrington series would work pretty well in space. At least, until they overheated from lack of radiators.

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(it's called that because for two years the main character was thought dead, hence why she got a ship class named after her. The Graysons didn't feel like changing it back to Medusa.)

But yeah. It's not aerodynamic. It doesn't have wings. It doesn't have huge masses connected by thin pylons. It's just a spindle with hammerheads on each end for chase weapons. Mostly it's the terminology that makes it seem like a sci-fi version of an age of sail story (which it actually is.) Such as the main weapons being mounted in 'broadsides' because the 'impeller gravity bands' of the engines prevent anything coming in or out from 'above' and 'below'.
If every cloud had a silver lining, there would be a lot more plane crashes.

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GeoModder
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Re: The "Real Aerospace" Thread

Post by GeoModder »

RedDwarfIV wrote:At least, until they overheated from lack of radiators.
Just fire up the 'fridge lasers/grasers. ;)
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RedDwarfIV
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Re: The "Real Aerospace" Thread

Post by RedDwarfIV »

GeoModder wrote:
RedDwarfIV wrote:At least, until they overheated from lack of radiators.
Just fire up the 'fridge lasers/grasers. ;)
'Cept that doesn't work either because fridges keep themselves cold by moving the heat outside. It's why leaving a fridge's door open doesn't make a room cold.

So whatever ship is carrying the fridge laser/graser is going to overheat even faster.
If every cloud had a silver lining, there would be a lot more plane crashes.

Nemo
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Re: The "Real Aerospace" Thread

Post by Nemo »

Think youre misunderstanding. There are infact lasers that refrigerate molecules and create BECs. Thats not what he was after. He was talking about using a heat powered laser to transfer that energy into space. Basically the same thing as a passive radiator, but LAZORS so better. Pure scifi, as so far as I am aware there is no way to passively create such a laser to pump that energy, but it gets used quite a bit.

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Re: The "Real Aerospace" Thread

Post by icekatze »

hi hi

Those pesky laws of thermodynamics, never letting anyone have any fun, or perpetual motion machines. Jerks. :P

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GeoModder
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Re: The "Real Aerospace" Thread

Post by GeoModder »

RedDwarfIV wrote:
GeoModder wrote:
RedDwarfIV wrote:At least, until they overheated from lack of radiators.
Just fire up the 'fridge lasers/grasers. ;)
'Cept that doesn't work either because fridges keep themselves cold by moving the heat outside. It's why leaving a fridge's door open doesn't make a room cold.

So whatever ship is carrying the fridge laser/graser is going to overheat even faster.
Someone doesn't seem to know his tropes here.
I recommend reading David Brin's Sundiver. ;)
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RedDwarfIV
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Re: The "Real Aerospace" Thread

Post by RedDwarfIV »

I think I get how it's supposed to work, but you're still going to generate waste heat.


... actually, this makes me wonder where the radiators are on TCA ships in Outsider. Loroi ships are mentioned as having radiators mounted in the engine pylons, but I haven't seen anything suggesting something similar on Human-built designs.
If every cloud had a silver lining, there would be a lot more plane crashes.

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Re: The "Real Aerospace" Thread

Post by Nemo »

Since theyre using reaction drives its possible to pump the heat into the fuel and dump it out the exhaust plume. In theory.

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Re: The "Real Aerospace" Thread

Post by Arioch »

Terran warships don't have defensive screens, so they have to avoid vulnerable protrusions that can be shot off. During combat, heat is accumulated in heat sinks, and after combat they extend retractable radiators to get rid of it.

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Re: The "Real Aerospace" Thread

Post by icekatze »

hi hi

I imagine that if you have fusion technology, you could that plasma containment technology to make extremely high temperature radiators, which would require a whole lot less surface area.

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Re: The "Real Aerospace" Thread

Post by Karst45 »

Nemo wrote:If the experimental control delivers similar results to the experimental results my reaction isn't success. I start looking for a failure in my measuring stick.
actually the Nasa test was (from what i hear) more of a confirmation of the Japan and English test. so if all get similar "measurement error" can we assume it not an error?
Zakharra wrote:With all of the sci-fi writers and artists out there, how many of their designs, do you think are viable ones? I have seen the designs Arioch has posted here on this site, the pictures and Deviant Arts, as well as the designs by some other artists, including one of my favorite sci-fi comic artists/authors, Steve Gallacci who wrote and made the Albedo/Command Review comic. It's a furry one for those who don't like that sort of thing, but the science in it is a hard realistic science and the furry aspect is easy to ignore for the story. From what I've seen, the technology there is fairly realistic and the vehicles and ships look like they would work. Like Arioch and others designs, I'm just wondering do you think those designs would actually work?
Well most people who work in this field probably are doing so because they were inspired but Science-fiction. And since Science-fiction is what drove their imagination, it safe to assume that they will try to mimic some of those design. Much like the Space-suite was inspired by some old scifi show of the time (sorry trying to find source but i only get those Z-2 Tron inspired suite for the suicide mars mission)

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Re: The "Real Aerospace" Thread

Post by Karst45 »

RedDwarfIV wrote:I think I get how it's supposed to work, but you're still going to generate waste heat.


... actually, this makes me wonder where the radiators are on TCA ships in Outsider. Loroi ships are mentioned as having radiators mounted in the engine pylons, but I haven't seen anything suggesting something similar on Human-built designs.

http://well-of-souls.com/outsider/outsider002.html

Could those 3 thing be also used as radiator?

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RedDwarfIV
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Re: The "Real Aerospace" Thread

Post by RedDwarfIV »

Karst45 wrote:
RedDwarfIV wrote:I think I get how it's supposed to work, but you're still going to generate waste heat.


... actually, this makes me wonder where the radiators are on TCA ships in Outsider. Loroi ships are mentioned as having radiators mounted in the engine pylons, but I haven't seen anything suggesting something similar on Human-built designs.

http://well-of-souls.com/outsider/outsider002.html

Could those 3 thing be also used as radiator?
I doubt it. The bottom one is painted white - good for reflecting heat, bad for losing it. The top two have barely any surface area. Far as I can tell, they're just pylons for the navigation lights.
If every cloud had a silver lining, there would be a lot more plane crashes.

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Cy83r
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Re: The "Real Aerospace" Thread

Post by Cy83r »

icekatze wrote:hi hi
Just because it looks like the spacecraft is travelling faster than light to someone on Earth, does not mean it is.
This is totally false. Its all relative. The speed of light is invariant in all reference frames, and things don't move faster than it in any reference frame, not just the reference frame of the traveler.

The reference frame of the traveler is not a privileged reference frame.

I'm not even talking about infinite mass, I'm talking about causality. Infinite mass is only one of many issues with FTL travel, and relativity absolutely enters into it. If it looks like it is going faster than the speed of light in any reference frame, then you can break causality.
Oh, please, breaking the speed of light is not breaking the speed of time. Arguably once you start exceeding the stasis of lightspeed it's more likely that the traveler's perception of time speeds up again, which implies a whole new barrier on speed- how long your crew are expected to live at FTL from the outside perception.

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Re: The "Real Aerospace" Thread

Post by icekatze »


TrashMan
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Re: The "Real Aerospace" Thread

Post by TrashMan »

RedDwarfIV wrote:Oddly, for a series so based in the Space Is An Ocean trope, spacecraft from the Honor Harrington series would work pretty well in space. At least, until they overheated from lack of radiators.

Image
(it's called that because for two years the main character was thought dead, hence why she got a ship class named after her. The Graysons didn't feel like changing it back to Medusa.)

I always chuckle when I see HH ships. They look like sex toys.

Of course, I shouldn't be talking, since I made this:
Image

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pinheadh78
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Re: The "Real Aerospace" Thread

Post by pinheadh78 »

@TrashMan HA! Freespace / Freespace 2 For the win! Shivan SJ Sathanas class shatting out a particle beam.


Update Edit: *** increases monitor brightness ** oh! now I see it, wow, that's terrible yet funny. I keep my monitor brightness + contrast low so couldn't really see the whole picture.
Last edited by pinheadh78 on Thu Oct 02, 2014 11:39 pm, edited 1 time in total.

TrashMan
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Re: The "Real Aerospace" Thread

Post by TrashMan »

Actually it's the GTVA Gigant(d)ick "shooting" the Sathanas in the rear from it's "Diffusion Induction Converter Kannon" . :lol:

What? :| .. it was a easter egg hidden in my campaign.

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Cy83r
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Re: The "Real Aerospace" Thread

Post by Cy83r »

icekatze wrote:hi hi

Actually, yes. The speed of light is intrinsically linked to the passage of time. This is not an optical illusion, or a trick of perception. The ability to travel faster than the speed of light will allow travelers to break causality.

The science of why this is the case is very strongly supported by relativity, which is in turn very strongly supported by observation.

Faster than light travel or communication, special relativity, and causality cannot coexist.
I'd argue you're misconstruing the mathematical concept of time itself with the act of observing time. Faster than light particles have been shown to exist theoretically according to the math by which, I believe I am correct in this, relativity is also defined as well as in actuality with the oddly behaving neutrino transformations measured, IIRC, earlier last year- or at least we believe we observed the neutrino operate in a FTL mode if the measurements are indeed correct, a second observation has delivered similar results and researchers are conducting a third similar experiment to add weight to that confirmation. Even further, the math on the Alcubierre warp drive seems like it is taken seriously enough that national resources are being devoted to reduce the theoretical energy cost of its operation. Moving space and the objects in it might be different from reaching a raw acceleration of c- which another thing I'm curious about, is the light-speed limit put at any particular reference frame? and does it apply to raw velocity or merely one's active acceleration away from a reference frame?

Causality always sounds like a ridiculous fantasy whenever someone tries to explain the damnable thing to me.

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Re: The "Real Aerospace" Thread

Post by RedDwarfIV »

The scientists doing that experiment didn't think it was likely the neutrinos actually went faster than light, but the media went mad over it, claiming 'Einstein is wrong!' etc. Then when the scientists find proof that theneutrinos in fact definitely did not go faster than light, the media starts yelling about how Einstein was right all along and aren't modern scientists just the silliest?

I think you're basing your assumptions on something that's been known to be false, even in the media, for some time now.
If every cloud had a silver lining, there would be a lot more plane crashes.

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