Miscellaneous Terran question-and-answer thread

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Philly
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Re: Miscellaneous Terran question-and-answer thread

Post by Philly »

Are the weapons that Terran's use entirely similar to what we use to today or are there more noteworthy advancements that have significantly altered how a gun in the future works i.e. hand-held railguns?

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Re: Miscellaneous Terran question-and-answer thread

Post by discord »

my guess would be ETC improvements(faster bullets, thereby more damage and longer theoretical range), higher accuracy(due to higher precision when making the weapons and optics), lighter weapons(better materials/design)
do note, these are things that are researched on today and will work, ETC(Electro Thermal Chemical) works quite well in a laboratory setting and could be put into use within a year if so desired, albeit in tanks and navy, not handheld weapons, multi spectrum sensors are used in the military today, on vehicles. and so on.
but in the end, someone from our time would probably still recognize a weapon from outsiderverse terra, and understand pretty much how it works.

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Arioch
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Re: Miscellaneous Terran question-and-answer thread

Post by Arioch »

Chemical propellant is probably still more energy-dense than batteries at Humanity's tech level, so most small arms would be very familiar-looking. The ammunition is probably caseless and with a variety of special-effect variants (armor piercing, incendiary, guided), but imagine the M41A from Aliens and you're pretty much there.

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Re: Miscellaneous Terran question-and-answer thread

Post by Philly »

Is there any particular reason that we haven't developed handheld railguns? My brother seems to be convinced that they would've had that by now before moving onto particle weapons.

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Re: Miscellaneous Terran question-and-answer thread

Post by Arioch »

Philly wrote:Is there any particular reason that we haven't developed handheld railguns? My brother seems to be convinced that they would've had that by now before moving onto particle weapons.
The problem is the portability of power, which is really the main reason why we're not all driving electric cars right now; battery technology has not kept pace with new systems' demand for power. For a portable railgun or laser to do significantly more damage than a chemically-propelled projectile, it would have to use such a terrific amount of energy that it probably would only be able to carry enough juice for a few shots. As we've been discussing in the gyrojet thread, a new weapon has to offer significant advantages to displace an existing one.

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Re: Miscellaneous Terran question-and-answer thread

Post by Philly »

Here's one that came to mind. The Terran ships run on fusion or at least I hope so. Currently almost all power plants rely on the heat generated to make steam that turns a turbine. Do the Terran's still follow the same process or have we discovered a more efficient means of harnessing power?

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Re: Miscellaneous Terran question-and-answer thread

Post by icekatze »

hi hi

Do you mean like Direct Energy Conversion?

Philly
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Re: Miscellaneous Terran question-and-answer thread

Post by Philly »

icekatze wrote:hi hi

Do you mean like Direct Energy Conversion?
Holy cow! I didn't think we were even researching such a thing. Uh.. yeah that is partially what I am thinking of, but also other methods that would just enhance what we currently we do.

Thanks for the link! :D

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Re: Miscellaneous Terran question-and-answer thread

Post by Arioch »

Yes, it would be fusion reactor. The reactor(s) are probably tied in some direct way to the drives, so that the reactor plasma is probably part of the drive exhaust, and so a) generating electricity is not the main thing that makes the drive work, and b) since you've got hot plasma being ejected at high speed, all you need to generate some parasitic electricity (to run the other ship systems) is to put a magnetic field in the path of this plasma. You might use a steam turbine to capture and use waste heat from the system, but I wouldn't imagine that it would be your main source of power.

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Re: Miscellaneous Terran question-and-answer thread

Post by Philly »

Arioch wrote:Yes, it would be fusion reactor. The reactor(s) are probably tied in some direct way to the drives, so that the reactor plasma is probably part of the drive exhaust, and so a) generating electricity is not the main thing that makes the drive work, and b) since you've got hot plasma being ejected at high speed, all you need to generate some parasitic electricity (to run the other ship systems) is to put a magnetic field in the path of this plasma. You might use a steam turbine to capture and use waste heat from the system, but I wouldn't imagine that it would be your main source of power.
So the fusion reactors are just for the engines? They have a separate reactor as their power source or am I just confusing myself?

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Re: Miscellaneous Terran question-and-answer thread

Post by Arioch »

Philly wrote:
Arioch wrote:Yes, it would be fusion reactor. The reactor(s) are probably tied in some direct way to the drives, so that the reactor plasma is probably part of the drive exhaust, and so a) generating electricity is not the main thing that makes the drive work, and b) since you've got hot plasma being ejected at high speed, all you need to generate some parasitic electricity (to run the other ship systems) is to put a magnetic field in the path of this plasma. You might use a steam turbine to capture and use waste heat from the system, but I wouldn't imagine that it would be your main source of power.
So the fusion reactors are just for the engines? They have a separate reactor as their power source or am I just confusing myself?
No, I'm just saying that providing electrical power to the ship is a secondary function of the main reactors.

Ships will also have some kind of auxiliary power source to provide electricity when the mains are offline, as well as batteries for storage.

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Re: Miscellaneous Terran question-and-answer thread

Post by Philly »

On a scale of 1 to 10 how utterly terrified are the Big Wigs of Earth Government and the Military of the situation?

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Re: Miscellaneous Terran question-and-answer thread

Post by Arioch »

Philly wrote:On a scale of 1 to 10 how utterly terrified are the Big Wigs of Earth Government and the Military of the situation?
Well, they don't know what they're up against, or what the international situation is really like, so there are people who will be optimistic and those who will be pessimistic. For all they know, the Orgus may have exaggerated the danger, and this might be the beginning of a golden age of trade and discovery for Humanity. Decisions are going to be made far away that will have great impact on Humanity, and that Earth government will have little say in, so I'm sure there's a certain amount of anxiety, but some military and TCA folks are probably quite pleased with the situation (as they know it). They've fought a long, losing political battle to build a defense fleet without any visible alien threat, and now their visions have been vindicated. Where they were getting their budgets cut, now they're getting money thrown at them, and all those opponents who argued against the Colonial military and who succeeded in getting defense programs cut are now in serious political trouble.

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Re: Miscellaneous Terran question-and-answer thread

Post by Philly »

Arioch wrote:
Philly wrote:On a scale of 1 to 10 how utterly terrified are the Big Wigs of Earth Government and the Military of the situation?
Well, they don't know what they're up against, or what the international situation is really like, so there are people who will be optimistic and those who will be pessimistic. For all they know, the Orgus may have exaggerated the danger, and this might be the beginning of a golden age of trade and discovery for Humanity. Decisions are going to be made far away that will have great impact on Humanity, and that Earth government will have little say in, so I'm sure there's a certain amount of anxiety, but some military and TCA folks are probably quite pleased with the situation (as they know it). They've fought a long, losing political battle to build a defense fleet without any visible alien threat, and now their visions have been vindicated. Where they were getting their budgets cut, now they're getting money thrown at them, and all those opponents who argued against the Colonial military and who succeeded in getting defense programs cut are now in serious political trouble.
Riight, I forgot that only Alex has definite though limited knowledge of the situation or at least a small glimpse of what the Loroi and Umiak can bring to bear. If they did know what Alex saw I'd say they would be at least an 8 or more.

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Re: Miscellaneous Terran question-and-answer thread

Post by RedDwarfIV »

'Cept Sol is quite a way away from the warzone and neither the Loroi nor Umiak knew about them previously.

Hell, given the difference in development speeds, by the time the war rolled onto Humanity's doorstep, they'd probably be on the combatants tech level if they'd never sent that mission.

Of course, the Loroi seem a bit in trouble at the moment, what with the Umiak countering their Farseeing ability, so they'd need all the help they could get if they don't want to attrit to death.
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Re: Miscellaneous Terran question-and-answer thread

Post by Zakharra »

RedDwarfIV wrote:'Cept Sol is quite a way away from the warzone and neither the Loroi nor Umiak knew about them previously.

Hell, given the difference in development speeds, by the time the war rolled onto Humanity's doorstep, they'd probably be on the combatants tech level if they'd never sent that mission.

Of course, the Loroi seem a bit in trouble at the moment, what with the Umiak countering their Farseeing ability, so they'd need all the help they could get if they don't want to attrit to death.


It's been stated that sooner than later, expansion by the Umiak or Loroi would have had one or both of them running into Human space without any warning on our part. At least this way there has been some advanced warning that something is out there.
Arioch wrote:
Philly wrote:On a scale of 1 to 10 how utterly terrified are the Big Wigs of Earth Government and the Military of the situation?
Well, they don't know what they're up against, or what the international situation is really like, so there are people who will be optimistic and those who will be pessimistic. For all they know, the Orgus may have exaggerated the danger, and this might be the beginning of a golden age of trade and discovery for Humanity. Decisions are going to be made far away that will have great impact on Humanity, and that Earth government will have little say in, so I'm sure there's a certain amount of anxiety, but some military and TCA folks are probably quite pleased with the situation (as they know it). They've fought a long, losing political battle to build a defense fleet without any visible alien threat, and now their visions have been vindicated. Where they were getting their budgets cut, now they're getting money thrown at them, and all those opponents who argued against the Colonial military and who succeeded in getting defense programs cut are now in serious political trouble.
Heh. Politicians will always be politicians. I'm sure a lot of them made plenty of political hay by getting the military cut and those funds allotted to their personal political pet causes (to fight poverty/healthcare/care for the elderly/whatever and are -very- resentful that funding for their pet projects are being cut. Those anti-military types will always find ways to disparage the military.

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Re: Miscellaneous Terran question-and-answer thread

Post by Suederwind »

RedDwarfIV wrote:Hell, given the difference in development speeds, by the time the war rolled onto Humanity's doorstep, they'd probably be on the combatants tech level if they'd never sent that mission.
How much time would it have taken the Loroi/Umiak to reach Human occupied space by "accident"?
I have my doubts that humanity would reach their tech level in time.
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Re: Miscellaneous Terran question-and-answer thread

Post by JQBogus »

Loroi orbit 1st artificial satellite : 475 CE
Loroi develop jump drive : 850 CE
Time elapsed : 375 years.

Humans orbit 1st artificial satellite : 1957 CE
Humans develop jump drive : Sometime between 2050 and 2107.
Time elapsed : 93 years, at least, 150 years, at most.

Assuming (a big assumption) that this is still indicative of the relative speed of advancement of each culture's tech, then humans advance 2 1/2 to 4 times as fast as the Loroi. Even going with the 4 times rate, Humanity wouldn't have had equivalent tech to the Loroi until around 2450, nearly 300 years after contact with the Orgus.

2050 (humans invent Jump Drive) + 400 Years = 2450
850 (Loroi invent Jump Drive) + 1600 Years = 2450


I seem to recall that a previous discussion said that Humanity going quiet might mean contact would take place in a decade or two, instead of a year or two, given that the war has spurred both the Loroi and the Umiak to increase their pace of their survey efforts, in order to try to find an end-around to the other sides defenses.

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Re: Miscellaneous Terran question-and-answer thread

Post by Mr Bojangles »

JQBogus wrote:Loroi orbit 1st artificial satellite : 475 CE
Loroi develop jump drive : 850 CE
Time elapsed : 375 years.

Humans orbit 1st artificial satellite : 1957 CE
Humans develop jump drive : Sometime between 2050 and 2107.
Time elapsed : 93 years, at least, 150 years, at most.

Assuming (a big assumption) that this is still indicative of the relative speed of advancement of each culture's tech, then humans advance 2 1/2 to 4 times as fast as the Loroi. Even going with the 4 times rate, Humanity wouldn't have had equivalent tech to the Loroi until around 2450, nearly 300 years after contact with the Orgus.

2050 (humans invent Jump Drive) + 400 Years = 2450
850 (Loroi invent Jump Drive) + 1600 Years = 2450


I seem to recall that a previous discussion said that Humanity going quiet might mean contact would take place in a decade or two, instead of a year or two, given that the war has spurred both the Loroi and the Umiak to increase their pace of their survey efforts, in order to try to find an end-around to the other sides defenses.
I think you're a bit off in your estimate of how far behind humanity is behind the Loroi and Umiak. According to the Insider, humanity is right on the edge of reaching TL10, whereas the Loroi and Umiak are early in TL11. Also to be found in the Insider under the Humanity in 2160 section, humanity's only about 3 generations behind the Loroi and Umiak. Assuming those are human generations, humanity is around a century behind.

Humanity developed jump tech in 2086 and developed its first particle weaponry sometime in the mid 22nd Century. So, humans went from TL7 (1957 and our first satellite, as you point out) to the edge of TL10 (blaster tech) in around a 200 hundred years. Much, much faster than the major combatants of this story. And, it's not like war and the threat of annihilation/subjugation will slow down development. The effect will be quite the opposite.

Based on what's been presented so far, if there was no expanding war, humanity would have likely reached the current tech level of the Loroi and Umiak in the mid 23rd Century and likely outpaced them soon thereafter.

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Re: Miscellaneous Terran question-and-answer thread

Post by JQBogus »

1) When i read the 'three generations behind' thing, I thought he was talking about technological generations, not biological ones.


2) Thanks for the actual date on human jump drive.

Point stands, though. Loroi took 375 years to go from first satellite to jump drive,then another 1310 years to get to where they are now.

Humanity took 129 years to go from first satellite to jump drive, getting there about 3 times as fast as the Loroi, and have had about 75 more years to get where they are now.

The catch up date with these numbers is somewhere around 2700.

If Human tech would have caught up with Loroi tech by 2250, it would mean that humanity would have gone from the invention of jump drive to current Loroi tech in ~165 years. A feat it took the Loroi ~1300 years to do. This would require human advancement to happen at 20 times the rate of Loroi advancement, rather than the 3 times that the satellite to jump drive comparison would indicate.

Maybe you're right, though. War & threat of war does seem to be a big motivator for humans to develop tech. Counter-argument to that, though, is that humans have spent most of their history in that state, so why should they suddenly go from 3x to 20x as fast?

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