Page 134: For Science!

Discussion regarding the Outsider webcomic, science, technology and science fiction.

Moderator: Outsider Moderators

novius
Posts: 654
Joined: Tue May 26, 2015 10:33 am

Re: Page 134: For Science!

Post by novius »

fredgiblet wrote:It's important to note that so far Fireblade has largely been responsible for keeping Alex from fucking up. In that capacity she can't be friendly or tender towards him. Simultaneously there's strong, albeit circumstantial, evidence that Fireblade isn't widely popular, so she probably behaves like that to everyone.
Still I think that for just showing him that she isn't as defenseless as she seemed to be that was a bit over the top.

First, Beryl did lay down the law and Alex did send a clear "message understood". Second, to convey to him that she has telekinetic abilities it would have been enough to simply arrest his movement (and maybe keep him suspended in the air - that would be quite the show of her abilities!) rather than shoving him back with enough force for bruising or maybe even cracking his skull.

Short of beating someone into submission, casual shows of violence would make people with some front line experiences even more stubborn and uncooperative. And, as we had seen now, it did little to ingratiate herself to him. After all, he had enough time to stew in his cell over it, too.

In addition, I think the lift stopping wasn't a coincidence in itself. It looks very much likely to me that she herself arrested the lift's movement just the moment when Alex was already struggling to maintain balance.

So yes, I do think that while that may be in her line of duty, she definitely let her personal feelings color her judgement.

Though, on the other hand, there is that one panel with a closeup of her face where she does actually seem to care about his wellbeing.

But... that was a single moment. After that, she was back to her abrasive self.
fredgiblet wrote: Might be that Alex is the person to crack her shell.
Not going to happen anytime soon, I think, unless there is something momentuous to happen. As I mentioned in another posting, perhaps in conjunction with his 'sixth sense' connected to her.

But for now, it's "I don't like you, and you hate my guts, so let's leave it at that".

fredgiblet
Moderator
Posts: 983
Joined: Mon Mar 21, 2011 4:02 pm

Re: Page 134: For Science!

Post by fredgiblet »

novius wrote:Second, to convey to him that she has telekinetic abilities it would have been enough to simply arrest his movement (and maybe keep him suspended in the air - that would be quite the show of her abilities!) rather than shoving him back with enough force for bruising or maybe even cracking his skull.
You're assuming she has that level of finesse. I don't recall Arioch ever giving specifics, but I believe that Fireblade is not on the high-tier of finesse with her abilities.

novius
Posts: 654
Joined: Tue May 26, 2015 10:33 am

Re: Page 134: For Science!

Post by novius »

Scynix wrote:Crossing my fingers Beryl realizes there's something going on, goes totally psychic-yandere and pushes the redhead into a cargo cabinet then seals it before she taints Alex and ruins the cute pairing/Beryl's chances of experimenting with sansai on humans.
Well, she almost went out of line over Alex and Talon 'just' holding hands. But that would be a sight to see... :D
Scynix wrote:Now I can't help but think humans have some latent, deep rooted 'sense' for telekinetic interactions. Or, the lack of interaction with species who had such abilities naturally 'dulled'/'created a psychic wall in' human minds. I'm very curious if Beryl could eventually push through given time/effort.

On the positive side should Alex decide to share that he could sense redhead (I wouldn't... who knows how they'd react?) this could indicate that eventually the Loroi will recognize humans aren't deliberately trying to block them.

I also get the impression Beryl seems to believe Alex's words now, without requiring any further probing. She doesn't seem to doubt him at all.
I think that Beryl pretty much believed that Alex himself is truthful as far as he knows it. After all, he had no firsthand experience with telepathy or any psychic powers before coming across the Loroi. She tried to make him secod-guess on what he could have taken for granted just before.

As for that "read-haired harpy" - I'm sure neither he and she would be thrilled by the idea to include her in further experiments. Beryl might suggest it because of scientific curiosity, if she would get past that bit of jealousy she already displayed.

On the other hand, Beryl might come to the conclusion that given enough effort, a Loroi could break through/bypass a Human's defenses, and she might be quite eager to try for more sessions...
Last edited by novius on Tue Jun 12, 2018 6:17 am, edited 1 time in total.

novius
Posts: 654
Joined: Tue May 26, 2015 10:33 am

Re: Page 134: For Science!

Post by novius »

fredgiblet wrote:
novius wrote:Second, to convey to him that she has telekinetic abilities it would have been enough to simply arrest his movement (and maybe keep him suspended in the air - that would be quite the show of her abilities!) rather than shoving him back with enough force for bruising or maybe even cracking his skull.
You're assuming she has that level of finesse. I don't recall Arioch ever giving specifics, but I believe that Fireblade is not on the high-tier of finesse with her abilities.
She might not be able to put a thread through a needle's ear, but one should assume that she has a rough measure over the force she wishes to apply. Okay. So lifting him up and keeping him level might be outside her level of control, but the difference between 'slight shove' and 'fling him into orbit' would be not.

boldilocks
Posts: 669
Joined: Fri Jun 02, 2017 3:27 pm

Re: Page 134: For Science!

Post by boldilocks »

dragoongfa wrote:Sex is no longer about reproduction [...]
Image
"Sex has changed"

entity2636
Posts: 339
Joined: Fri Jan 12, 2018 11:53 am

Re: Page 134: For Science!

Post by entity2636 »

Scynix wrote:Crossing my fingers Beryl realizes there's something going on, goes totally psychic-yandere and pushes the redhead into a cargo cabinet then seals it before she taints Alex and ruins the cute pairing/Beryl's chances of experimenting with sansai on humans.

***

Redhead is a meany. Beryl, strike first!
LOL Now I'm not sure if you're serious or BS'ing (probably the second), but should Beryl ever do or say something to anger Fireblade, they'd have to hose what's left of Beryl off the deck.

The next is non-canon, but I'd say it fits so well in the setting that it might as well be canon. The Listels (like Beryl) say that Teidar don't normally speak aloud, but when they do, they do it to challenge the Listel and it always results in the Listel being a smear on the floor.

That and a science officer/sensor operator should know better not to piss off a marine major who's the chief of security.

Voitan
Posts: 214
Joined: Wed Apr 06, 2011 3:04 am

Re: Page 134: For Science!

Post by Voitan »

Oh there's a torpedo launching alright.

boldilocks
Posts: 669
Joined: Fri Jun 02, 2017 3:27 pm

Re: Page 134: For Science!

Post by boldilocks »

Scynix wrote:Redhead is a meany. Beryl, strike first!
Strike first! Strike hard! Treat Alex very well.

novius
Posts: 654
Joined: Tue May 26, 2015 10:33 am

Re: Page 134: For Science!

Post by novius »

Voitan wrote:Oh there's a torpedo launching alright.
boldilocks wrote:
Scynix wrote:Redhead is a meany. Beryl, strike first!
Strike first! Strike hard! Treat Alex very well.
Beryl: "Oh, we have about.... *scribble, scribble, calculate* ... 680 solons left before impact. You wouldn't let me die without ever ... well..."

raistlin34
Posts: 270
Joined: Sun Nov 08, 2015 3:46 pm

Re: Page 134: For Science!

Post by raistlin34 »

novius wrote:
Voitan wrote:Oh there's a torpedo launching alright.
boldilocks wrote:
Scynix wrote:Redhead is a meany. Beryl, strike first!
Strike first! Strike hard! Treat Alex very well.
Beryl: "Oh, we have about.... *scribble, scribble, calculate* ... 680 solons left before impact. You wouldn't let me die without ever ... well..."
Beryl has children, so she is not a virgin.

Krulle
Posts: 1413
Joined: Wed May 20, 2015 9:14 am

Re: Page 134: For Science!

Post by Krulle »

But never with an alien. A pinkish male.
Nor with a diplomat (likely).
Nor with *him*.
Vote for Outsider on TWC: Image
charred steppes, borders of territories: page 59,
jump-map of local stars: page 121, larger map in Loroi: page 118,
System view Leido Crossroads: page 123, after the battle page 195

User avatar
icekatze
Posts: 1399
Joined: Sat Mar 05, 2011 8:35 pm
Location: Middle of Nowhere
Contact:

Re: Page 134: For Science!

Post by icekatze »

hi hi

Also, quick question for Arioch: how do you do the offset text used in "Enemy torpedo launch detected." Do you place each letter separately, or use a tool?

User avatar
Arioch
Site Admin
Posts: 4486
Joined: Sat Mar 05, 2011 4:19 am
Location: San Jose, CA
Contact:

Re: Page 134: For Science!

Post by Arioch »

icekatze wrote:Also, quick question for Arioch: how do you do the offset text used in "Enemy torpedo launch detected." Do you place each letter separately, or use a tool?
You can place each letter separately, or if you just want to displace them vertically, you can use the super/subscript setting in the character pane. In this case it alternates between 1, 0, and -1.

Image

(This is Photoshop, in case it's not obvious.)

Scynix
Posts: 9
Joined: Mon Jun 11, 2018 9:31 am

Re: Page 134: For Science!

Post by Scynix »

novius wrote: Well, she almost went out of line over Alex and Talon 'just' holding hands. But that would be a sight to see... :D
The implication, at least to me, is that Beryl's caste are the inquisitive type but that doesn't explain her reaction to the pilot shaking his hand. As you say, that stung of simple jealousy. I think Beryl wanted to be the one to test it and that's why despite the circumstances she still requested the chance. It bothered her.
Which is cute, too! Go Beryl! For SCIENCE!
<Team Beryl!>
I do have to question her getting THAT close to him after the hand thing didn't work. It's a bit of a leap to go from "is it ok to touch hands?" to straight up hugging/pressing your forehead against someone.
She demonstrated a level of forethought about respecting another species interactions (which is good!) but seeing as Alex only acknowledged handshakes, this was one heck of a jump forward from handshaking.
Good for you Beryl!
Curious kills cats but you're a space elf! Keep investigating!
entity2636 wrote:LOL Now I'm not sure if you're serious or BS'ing (probably the second), but should Beryl ever do or say something to anger Fireblade, they'd have to hose what's left of Beryl off the deck.
I agree, I think redhead would obliterate Beryl in combat- but Beryl has advantages, too! Alex seemingly trusts her. Redhead has only, at this point, actively demonstrated her ability to fling Alex around like a doll. Not particularly endearing.
I wasn't saying Beryl should fight redhead- just keep getting ahead of her in terms of friendship/trust.
I agree with the others that I think redhead has become at least temporarily Alex's bodyguard. And I also agree that she was probably only hostile in the elevator as a demonstration of her ability and maybe even a test to see if terrans can react/are affected by the telekinetic ability.
After that incident, Redhead has been very forward about her duty.
Didn't redhead even plop down next to Alex just like Beryl when there was CLEARLY space for her to sit away from him if she really had a problem with him?
http://well-of-souls.com/outsider/outsider072.html
Yep! This is what my best friend would call "being crafty"! Sneaky redhead.
I enjoy Alex's look of "ehhh?". :D
raistlin34 wrote:Beryl has children, so she is not a virgin.
Edit: After some search digging, I found Arioch's mention Beryl has children.

That begs many questions that I'll have to retain until we know more about the Loroi. They imply they've optimized their society for war, which would mean reproduction and child rearing would be completely different than what we experience. In a society under a state of total war, maternity leave seems unlikely.

Off this specific subject though...

On my last read through, I noticed something that didn't stand out before. I was looking for that earlier image and I noticed this again.
It seems like the Loroi don't understand sarcasm. Anyone else notice that? Especially Beryl. Byproduct of sansai possibly?

fredgiblet
Moderator
Posts: 983
Joined: Mon Mar 21, 2011 4:02 pm

Re: Page 134: For Science!

Post by fredgiblet »

Scynix wrote:That begs many questions that I'll have to retain until we know more about the Loroi. They imply they've optimized their society for war, which would mean reproduction and child rearing would be completely different than what we experience. In a society under a state of total war, maternity leave seems unlikely.
Reproduction is ritualized and controlled by the state, you only get to bone when the government says so. Your children aren't yours to raise, they are raised with a cohort of other children by professionals. Beryl may very well have never met her children after their birth.

User avatar
orion1836
Posts: 399
Joined: Mon Feb 06, 2017 11:38 pm

Re: Page 134: For Science!

Post by orion1836 »

You all and this 'redhead' business. She has a name, you know... F-I-R-E-B-L-A-D-E.

Or we could just call her Harpy McHarpyface from now on. :D

novius
Posts: 654
Joined: Tue May 26, 2015 10:33 am

Re: Page 134: For Science!

Post by novius »

Scynix wrote: The implication, at least to me, is that Beryl's caste are the inquisitive type but that doesn't explain her reaction to the pilot shaking his hand. As you say, that stung of simple jealousy. I think Beryl wanted to be the one to test it and that's why despite the circumstances she still requested the chance. It bothered her.
Which is cute, too! Go Beryl! For SCIENCE!
<Team Beryl!>
Not just her caste. Herself, too. She's scarily intelligent, has an eidetic memory and an eye for details. For example she picked up on the inconsistencies of english spelling just from the few examples Alex has on his overall. She is eager to learn and fond of puzzles, and Alex presents the biggest one to her - himself. Might be she is already developing feelings for him - curiosity makes a good part of attraction, after all - but at the moment her jealousy is mostly the dismay a kid would feel when a sibling came to play with the favourite toy.
Scynix wrote:I do have to question her getting THAT close to him after the hand thing didn't work. It's a bit of a leap to go from "is it ok to touch hands?" to straight up hugging/pressing your forehead against someone.
She demonstrated a level of forethought about respecting another species interactions (which is good!) but seeing as Alex only acknowledged handshakes, this was one heck of a jump forward from handshaking.
Good for you Beryl!
Curious kills cats but you're a space elf! Keep investigating!
To me it looks much to me that skin-to-skin contact is the one big barrier which would border intimacy. As in, this would be the threshold where two Loroi do have to consent on (or can only be passed under dire circumstances), but beyond that there are little to no further thresholds to pass. I think I've read somewhere that Loroi do have a rather matter-of-fact approach to sex, for example, so I'd guess they'd rate the mental contact a touch provides much higher on the level of intimacy then sex itself. The latter one is just a function of the body and endorphins, but the former one is a deep melding of one self to one another.

That would definitely add to the harsh reaction Beryl displayed on seeing him and Talon, for sure. And, Alex simply might not have been aware of the extent on what he agreed to.
Scynix wrote:
I agree, I think redhead would obliterate Beryl in combat- but Beryl has advantages, too! Alex seemingly trusts her. Redhead has only, at this point, actively demonstrated her ability to fling Alex around like a doll. Not particularly endearing.
I wasn't saying Beryl should fight redhead- just keep getting ahead of her in terms of friendship/trust.
Geeks don't get angry. They get even. :geek:
Scynix wrote:I agree with the others that I think redhead has become at least temporarily Alex's bodyguard. And I also agree that she was probably only hostile in the elevator as a demonstration of her ability and maybe even a test to see if terrans can react/are affected by the telekinetic ability.
I think it was on boarding the Highland-7 where Beryl explicitely states that Fireblade is deployed as his bodyguard. Alex was obviously less than thrilled about it. And my bet is on Fireblade being rather hacked off, either. For her it must feel like a demotion from being chief of security on SG51's flagship down to bodyguard/nanny for a pink alien of dubious origin.

Yep. I bet on that she doesn't like her assignment one bit and would want to have as little to do with Alex as possible, and if they cross paths, she won't be above making her displeasure known to him.
Scynix wrote:After that incident, Redhead has been very forward about her duty.
Didn't redhead even plop down next to Alex just like Beryl when there was CLEARLY space for her to sit away from him if she really had a problem with him?
http://well-of-souls.com/outsider/outsider072.html
Yep! This is what my best friend would call "being crafty"! Sneaky redhead.
I enjoy Alex's look of "ehhh?". :D
I'd interpret that look much more as *gulp* - she's slightly taller than him, lean, but with a definite muscle tonus (as much as the armor can tell) and has a scary ability to do him serious bodily harm without even touching him. Then he's within her arm's reach. Her whole posture tells of her displeasure and raising a barrier facing him. And she's giving him a look saying much like "Don't try anything funny.", coupled with the slight frown.

Much in contrast to Beryl's posture. She very much looks as if she'd like to start her experiments with skin-to-skin contact even that early on. Hmh - maybe Fireblade's look was partly aimed at her, too :)
Scynix wrote: It seems like the Loroi don't understand sarcasm. Anyone else notice that? Especially Beryl. Byproduct of sansai possibly?
They see speech as a method to conceal/distort the truth and doing so as a dishonorable thing to do. So yes, the concept of telling the opposite and only having posture, expressions and tone of voice convey that something has to be taken the other way round than the literal words say might be completely alien to them.

fredgiblet
Moderator
Posts: 983
Joined: Mon Mar 21, 2011 4:02 pm

Re: Page 134: For Science!

Post by fredgiblet »

Scynix wrote:Didn't redhead even plop down next to Alex just like Beryl when there was CLEARLY space for her to sit away from him if she really had a problem with him?
http://well-of-souls.com/outsider/outsider072.html
Yep! This is what my best friend would call "being crafty"! Sneaky redhead.
I enjoy Alex's look of "ehhh?". :D
I would point out that this is also very possibly an artistic choice to put the three of them right next to each other for the purposes of framing, rather than to imply any specific meaning for the characters.

User avatar
cacambo43
Posts: 301
Joined: Wed Oct 31, 2012 11:39 am
Location: The Space Coast
Contact:

Re: Page 134: For Science!

Post by cacambo43 »

Arioch is quite talented at conveying emotion and depth in his characters' facial expressions, so I find it funny that some of us have such different opinions on what Fireblade's expressions seem to indicate. Some of us (including me) see her as concerned and interested - as well as annoyed at times - while others seem to see her as seething with disdain, if not anger/hatred at him! It's going to be great when it all sorts out...

I also have to agree that it seems strange, given what has come to light about the Loroi, both on these forums and the Insider pages, that Beryl has jumped to such an intimate posture with Alex - and that they're pretty much in the middle of the flight deck, with others in the area - telepathically and physically. I hope the little couple bubble they've made gets burst soon, else the credibility of the scene might start to suffer.

CJSF

novius
Posts: 654
Joined: Tue May 26, 2015 10:33 am

Re: Page 134: For Science!

Post by novius »

cacambo43 wrote:Arioch is quite talented at conveying emotion and depth in his characters' facial expressions, so I find it funny that some of us have such different opinions on what Fireblade's expressions seem to indicate. Some of us (including me) see her as concerned and interested - as well as annoyed at times - while others seem to see her as seething with disdain, if not anger/hatred at him! It's going to be great when it all sorts out...

I also have to agree that it seems strange, given what has come to light about the Loroi, both on these forums and the Insider pages, that Beryl has jumped to such an intimate posture with Alex - and that they're pretty much in the middle of the flight deck, with others in the area - telepathically and physically. I hope the little couple bubble they've made gets burst soon, else the credibility of the scene might start to suffer.

CJSF
Well... Talon and Spiral were (and are now more than ever) occupied with piloting the shuttle, so Alex and Beryl were pretty much left to their own devices. But yes, something has to happen, and soon. Likely that they will have to buckle up in preparation for some tight turns, or Alex will get a firsthand experience of Loroi spacesuits or emergency measures...

And Fireblade? I said it myself, she is difficult to read. Though apart from that one moment where they had to make a quick egress from Tempest's bridge, she did show him nothing but derision and disdain. Maybe not outright hatred, but that kind of look you'd usually reserve for something disgusting you scrape off your boot.

Could be that part of her derision is aimed at Beryl, too. As in, Fireblade simply can't fathom why that slip of a girl Listel Tozet is so ga-ga over him.

There's something else in addition. If one looks closer at Fireblade's posture in his mind's eye, she still seems pretty much relaxed. Though... she sits sort of sideways to him in relation to Alex himself, but it looks like she already turned her head in his direction. Maybe she did notice something odd, already?

Post Reply