Couple questions

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Ktrain
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Re: Couple questions

Post by Ktrain »

Arioch wrote:I was thinking of "primary" in terms of tonnage, not dollar value.
Ghaaa, microeconomic accounting measures, my only weakness....
Thanks for the clarification and tolerating my over-analysis.
Trantor wrote: They´re communists? :)
Sounds more like a West Virginia coal town to me... the more and more I learn about the Loroi economy, the more I feel that there are a lot of disgruntled/alienated workers. One's freedom is so constrained, both economically and sexually

Also the better term might be statist, communist has certain ideological ideals about egalitarianism which the Loroi do not share
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Grayhome
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Re: Couple questions

Post by Grayhome »

How many driver rounds is a Terran vessel stocked with? For heavy and medium rounds respectively I was wondering how many reloads they could have.

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Arioch
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Re: Couple questions

Post by Arioch »

Grayhome wrote:How many driver rounds is a Terran vessel stocked with? For heavy and medium rounds respectively I was wondering how many reloads they could have.
A destroyer would probably have about 250 rounds in its magazines, and a heavy cruiser perhaps 1000.

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Mjolnir
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Re: Couple questions

Post by Mjolnir »

Arioch wrote:
Grayhome wrote:How many driver rounds is a Terran vessel stocked with? For heavy and medium rounds respectively I was wondering how many reloads they could have.
A destroyer would probably have about 250 rounds in its magazines, and a heavy cruiser perhaps 1000.
Would the limitation be ammunition mass, or wear on the rails making it pointless to carry more?

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Arioch
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Re: Couple questions

Post by Arioch »

Probably a combination of cost, weight, and the number of rounds thought likely to be fired in an engagement. Those numbers are, I believe, typical of the number of primary-armament shells carried by WWII surface vessels.

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Re: Couple questions

Post by fredgiblet »

Since my thread has been resurrected:

Is the Listel's eidetic memory a psi ability or a mundane ability?
Does a Loroi who fails the tests for a specialty caste (Teidar for instance) have an opportunity to try again at a "lower" caste like Soroin? Or is it a one-shot deal where you go big or go home?

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Re: Couple questions

Post by javcs »

Actually, I'd expect driver round mass to be a less important factor than driver round volume.
Sure, the mass is important (technically), but at the scale of the drives, even Terran drives, mass is probably less of a limiting factor on storage than the volume required for that storage. How much does a round mass? Maybe a hundred kilograms or so? How much does a ship mass? Maybe 75 thousand or more tons (empty) for a Terran scout? A significant amount more when the consumables (food, air, water, fuel) are all loaded. The relative mass increase for more rounds is almost certainly going to negligible when compared to the amount of force the propulsion systems are putting out, but the relative volume increase is going to be noticeable.

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Arioch
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Re: Couple questions

Post by Arioch »

I'm having trouble finding reliable numbers on WWII-era destroyer magazine capacities. It looks like modern destroyers carry more like 500 rounds per mount, so perhaps the numbers I quoted may be on the low side. But it's in that order of magnitude.
fredgiblet wrote:Is the Listel's eidetic memory a psi ability or a mundane ability?
It's a mundane ability, just like human "photographic" memory.
fredgiblet wrote:Does a Loroi who fails the tests for a specialty caste (Teidar for instance) have an opportunity to try again at a "lower" caste like Soroin? Or is it a one-shot deal where you go big or go home?
The trials are a form of extended basic training, and are uniformly tough, so a warrior candidate who can't handle Teidar trials won't find the Soroin version any easier (and the Soroin would chafe at being referred to as a "lower" caste). However, if a candidate in a specialty caste is having troubles with skills or abilities that are specific to the specialty, then she may be passed through the trials and subsequently transferred to a more appropriate specialty.

The warrior trials are as much of a rite of passage as they are a test. Being born the daughter of a warrior in some ways is considered as having the "right" to become a warrior, and so unless she is unfit, outright incompetent or quits/refuses, it is uncommon for a candidate to fail the trials. They are as much of a group trial as they are an individual trial; failures of individuals are stikes against the whole band, so the rest of the band will usually try to "carry" the weaker members through to initiation. However, everyone in the band knows who the weak links are, and in subsequent training these individuals will be steered toward desk jobs (the warrior classes having no shortage of bureaucratic positions that need filling).

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Re: Couple questions

Post by icekatze »

hi hi

I'm pretty sure mass is still the most important consideration for space travel concerns, since all movement is complicated by having extra mass. If volume was a concern, I think we'd probably see ship designs that are more spherical in nature, since those are inherently more volume efficient than cylindrical designs. (and significantly narrower corridors, though I realize that a lot of this is artistic license, so grain of salt taken.)

Things also tend to get more volume efficient as they get bigger, but we don't really know many specifics about how much armor plating costs. Still, for non-volatile components like mass driver rounds, you could probably store extras in an unshielded section of the ship with no real volume costs.

I always had the idea for rail guns that you could include a "rail lining" in with each round. Each time a round is fired, it shreds most of the rail liner, leaving the rail undamaged. Then, as the new round is chambered, the old lining is replaced with a new one at the same time.

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Re: Couple questions

Post by NOMAD »

Arioch wrote:I'm having trouble finding reliable numbers on WWII-era destroyer magazine capacities. It looks like modern destroyers carry more like 500 rounds per mount, so perhaps the numbers I quoted may be on the low side. But it's in that order of magnitude.

.
hey Arioch, not sure if these could work for you but
WWII US main guns
http://pwencycl.kgbudge.com/U/s/US_5_38_DP_gun.htm
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Mjolnir
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Re: Couple questions

Post by Mjolnir »

javcs wrote:Actually, I'd expect driver round mass to be a less important factor than driver round volume.
Sure, the mass is important (technically), but at the scale of the drives, even Terran drives, mass is probably less of a limiting factor on storage than the volume required for that storage. How much does a round mass? Maybe a hundred kilograms or so? How much does a ship mass? Maybe 75 thousand or more tons (empty) for a Terran scout? A significant amount more when the consumables (food, air, water, fuel) are all loaded. The relative mass increase for more rounds is almost certainly going to negligible when compared to the amount of force the propulsion systems are putting out, but the relative volume increase is going to be noticeable.
Cost might be a bigger issue than mass. Heavily mechanically reinforced superconducting structures capable of carrying massive currents under high field strengths while withstanding the forces of being shot out a railgun or other sort of mass driver, all without failing in any way that significantly changes their exit velocity or trajectory...and of course, without exploding inside the gun.

Arioch wrote:The trials are a form of extended basic training, and are uniformly tough, so a warrior candidate who can't handle Teidar trials won't find the Soroin version any easier (and the Soroin would chafe at being referred to as a "lower" caste). However, if a candidate in a specialty caste is having troubles with skills or abilities that are specific to the specialty, then she may be passed through the trials and subsequently transferred to a more appropriate specialty.
Given their lifespans, how common would it be for someone to change caste (or undertake the trials and duties of another caste) simply due to boredom/desire for something new/to extend their abilities further, rather than lack of ability?

Might individuals who started out as another caste be sought after for certain positions? Someone who didn't work out as a Teidar ending up as a Soroin engineer/technician working on the front lines alongside them, for example...

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Re: Couple questions

Post by Arioch »

Thanks NOMAD, that's very helpful information. 500 rounds per gun mount does sound much more reasonable.
Mjolnir wrote: Given their lifespans, how common would it be for someone to change caste (or undertake the trials and duties of another caste) simply due to boredom/desire for something new/to extend their abilities further, rather than lack of ability?
Not very common. Requests for transfer are not often granted, if the warrior is competent at her current post (especially if it's an in-demand specialty like the Teidar). The castes are insular and competitive. And since switching tracks usually means starting over in terms of rank, few career-minded warriors will consider it. That said, such changes do happen: Ashrain successfully switched tracks from Teidar to Soroin (it helps if your great-aunt is the Emperor).

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Re: Couple questions

Post by fredgiblet »

What about same caste different branch? For example an Army chick who's bored of waiting and asks to be transferred to the Navy?

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Re: Couple questions

Post by NOMAD »

Arioch wrote:Thanks NOMAD, that's very helpful information. 500 rounds per gun mount does sound much more reasonable.
hey I do what I can and your welcome
Arioch wrote:
Mjolnir wrote: Given their lifespans, how common would it be for someone to change caste (or undertake the trials and duties of another caste) simply due to boredom/desire for something new/to extend their abilities further, rather than lack of ability?
Not very common. Requests for transfer are not often granted, if the warrior is competent at her current post (especially if it's an in-demand specialty like the Teidar). The castes are insular and competetive. And since switching tracks usually means starting over in terms of rank, few career-minded warriors will consider it. That said, such changes do happen: Ashrain successfully switched tracks from Teidar to Soroin (it helps if your great-aunt is the Emperor).
So if your relatives are high enough in rank, you can get a transfer. I guess something don't change, even in alien militarises, have the right connections and you can get what :( Excuse the negativity, had a bad experience
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Arioch
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Re: Couple questions

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What I try to convey in the Loroi is a military society for whom the paramount consideration is duty. To even ask for reassignment would be incredibly arrogant, considering that tens of thousands of civilian Loroi would pay in blood to have a chance at the privileged life that even the most junior warriors enjoy. "Boredom" is not considered important in a society in which people are literally asked to die for a living. Most especially in wartime where everyone is very much needed at the post in which they are most effective.

In Ashrain's case, it was not she who asked for transfer to the Soroin caste, but rather power-brokers on behalf of her family (shortly after her aunt Greywind has risen to power), knowing that she would now have a serious chance of rising to flag authority. When Ashrain did indeed quickly rise to Torrai rank, it was then she herself who asked to be transferred back to the fighting commands, and few commanders (even despite political pressure) could refuse such a request.

Profession, especially amongst the military class, is not a matter of personal choice. In peacetime there were probably very many bored older Loroi warriors, but there was also a much greater number of bored junior warriors who were eager to replace them. Our modern Western sense of guaranteed improved standard of living and changing jobs on a regular basis is almost unknown among the regular classes of the Loroi. If you have a good position, you do well to keep it for your whole life.

The Loroi warrior class is very serious about its ideals of service and duty. There will always be those individuals who may seek to abuse their power for personal gain (as in any form of government, including our own), but if the Loroi warrior classes as a whole had not been willing to put their blood on the line for the common good, I don't think they would have been able to maintain power for as long as they have.

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Re: Couple questions

Post by NOMAD »

Arioch wrote:What I try to convey in the Loroi is a military society for whom the paramount consideration is duty. To even ask for reassignment would be incredibly arrogant, considering that tens of thousands of civilian Loroi would pay in blood to have a chance at the privileged life that even the most junior warriors enjoy.
my apologies Arioch sincerely. I didn't think about the loroi warrior's that way, kinda makes the loroi more "noble" in their way.
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Ktrain
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Re: Couple questions

Post by Ktrain »

Since we get occasional pinups of blue elf chicks, could we eventually get one of Kikitik-27 ;) ?
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Re: Couple questions

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Ktrain wrote:Since we get occasional pinups of blue elf chicks, could we eventually get one of Kikitik-27 ;) ?
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Re: Couple questions

Post by Cdr Straker »

Ghaaaaaa!!!!!! MY EYES!!!!!!!! :)
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Re: Couple questions

Post by manticore7 »

Dr Strangelove anyone?
"Worlds governed by artificial intelligence often learned a hard lesson, Logic doesn't care"
Andromeda season 2 episode 6 All too Human

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