Page 164: Smells like buttocks!

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orion1836
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Re: Page 164: Smells like buttocks!

Post by orion1836 »

If it were me, I would find a way to convey (silently) the situation with the Historian. Alex is there to make contact/pursue relations with the Loroi or the Umiak, not any other client species. I would not want to risk Humanity's image in Loroi eyes at all. Assuming the pocket historian is blind with the data pad in his pocket, Alex could attempt to carry on a "regular" conversation with the Loroi while writing out what transpired. Alternately, he could attempt to whisper it directly into the ears of Tempo at a level where the microphone on the data pad could not pick it up.

This all assumes, of course, that the big container doesn't have surveillance equipment of its own... which now that I think of it, it probably does.

If the Loroi have ill intent for Alex... his mission has already failed. Allying/helping the Historian might improve his individual position, but will only make things worse for Humanity. If the Historian is just trying to play him, exposing it to the Loroi will only help his standing in their eyes.

Based on what I've seen and the Historian's dialogue, I believe Prophet's Reason is going to attempt a pickup of Alex, and only Alex, with the purpose of parading him around to undermine the Loroi claim to genetic supremacy. Why else would they not want to tell the Loroi crew of their arrival? They'd have a much better chance against a powered-down shuttle and sluggish guards (including a Teidar) with the element of surprise. The Historian is helping them in this for their own balance-of-power reasons, the specifics of which I can't guess. I don't think Alex will hand over the Historian before he gets picked up, but once he realizes what is happening, I think he'll do what he can to resist and get the Loroi rescued.

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SaintofM
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Re: Page 164: Smells like buttocks!

Post by SaintofM »

In this situation, Alex's only friends are the ones haunting his dreams.

The comanding officer may have her own plans for him as if this works out this will mean prestige and fame throughout the system, and one hell of a promotion. If nothing else, for a none combat role, this will mean prestige for her class. If things go thought, well pinky can always go in an open airlock.

Fireblade does not like him, and probably has a more commanding presence than the other security detail. I am not sure why she does not like him, but yelling at her when he was first probed and she may not liked to have failed at rbing the alien.

Or she may now have a connection with the Humaniti due to the fact she mind raped him so hard he can see her even when his eyes were closed. I suspect she might be seeing some of the random bits of memory in her dreams and is tired of the chaos. She might want to sever that connection the easy way. The REAL easy way.

THe others would follow orders no matter what. Beryl showed the most concern for him throughout but when rank was pulled she had to step away in the interrogation room.

Angle
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Re: Page 164: Smells like buttocks!

Post by Angle »

Eh, the historian is interesting. Why did it reveal itself to him at all? It seems like it should have easily been able to just hack the device without him knowing, and then do whatever it wanted. :/

boldilocks
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Re: Page 164: Smells like buttocks!

Post by boldilocks »

icekatze wrote:Still, from my limited perspective, the Historian's stance sounds like a con. Alex's cooperation seems to provide no concrete benefits and only drawbacks.
The immediate pro of the Historian seems to be an alleged contact with the barsam ship, and the possibility of rendezvous.

Krulle
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Re: Page 164: Smells like buttocks!

Post by Krulle »

Werra wrote:Would any of you hand over the Historian and lose out on what might be the only chance for a non Loroi perspective?
Difficult question.

My life depends on the Loroi.
And their goodwill and trust. [*]

I am their "guest", but have no way of contacting or going home.

Likely I would want to hear a bit about Loroi relationship with the different races of the Union, especially the Historians, because they seem to be seclusive when only using an AI/personality construct on missions. - Yes, I want continued access to the Historian construct. It could give me a different view, and thus allow my decisions to be of better informed quality than purely information given by the Loroi.

Likely I'll come to the conclusion that I'd want the Loroi to know about the construct, but that I would require them to leave me full access to "my datapad", as I am the Human Ambassador, and the data pad is Human property. - Yes, I'd give the Loroi time for discussions with the personality construct too, if needed without me. The Loroi must be able to trust this device as well, otherwise it and me would get "silenced" the harsh way too.

So I'd likely wait a day or two to try to get the information of how Loroi interact with the Loroi Union members, and then try to throw ashes on my head for having not yet told them about it, but have a conversation of all three (Loroi, construct, and myself).
But I would very likely not tell the Loroi about the warning (and I would want some time free of interruption (from Loroi) to discuss with the personality construct about its motives and reasons).
And I would request paper/pen, for personal information storage, as some information should not be stored on the Historian-infiltrated datapad.


[*]knowing that the Historian Construct could get me killed as quickly as well, if it has means to undetectably inform Historians, then it could also alert whatever to shoot down this shuttle.
Vote for Outsider on TWC: Image
charred steppes, borders of territories: page 59,
jump-map of local stars: page 121, larger map in Loroi: page 118,
System view Leido Crossroads: page 123, after the battle page 195

kiwi
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Re: Page 164: Smells like buttocks!

Post by kiwi »

I don’t know what I would do about the Pocket Historian. I don’t know what Alex should do.

But from a dramatic perspective, it’s great that Alex has a choice to make.

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SaintofM
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Re: Page 164: Smells like buttocks!

Post by SaintofM »

Dramatic yes, but he also has to consider all angels as even though he represents humanity to the blue space elves, he needs to know more about them and the Historian would best do that.

I also have a feeling Arioch chose the name Historian for a reason considering what that is in the english language, so this might be able to get some more lore on them.

I also suspect the Historian also had an idea on how to gauge Alex from its limited interaction and observation of him, and more importantly going throuhg the ship records on the human ship and whatever was on the data pad to make an accurate guess what Alex would do.

Murph
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Re: Page 164: Smells like buttocks!

Post by Murph »

But, who are the good guys (or gals) and who are the bad guys? I suspect the Umiak are bad guys, but the others? Hmmmmm.

Murph
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Re: Page 164: Smells like buttocks!

Post by Murph »

boldilocks wrote:
icekatze wrote:Still, from my limited perspective, the Historian's stance sounds like a con. Alex's cooperation seems to provide no concrete benefits and only drawbacks.
The immediate pro of the Historian seems to be an alleged contact with the barsam ship, and the possibility of rendezvous.
What is the game the Historian is playing? What has been revealed so far is they tend to take a long view and play a long game.

raistlin34
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Re: Page 164: Smells like buttocks!

Post by raistlin34 »

Murph wrote:But, who are the good guys (or gals) and who are the bad guys? I suspect the Umiak are bad guys, but the others? Hmmmmm.
Why do you assume this is a bad guys(or gals) vs good guys scenario?

novius
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Re: Page 164: Smells like buttocks!

Post by novius »

raistlin34 wrote:Why do you assume this is a bad guys(or gals) vs good guys scenario?
It has been said from the very start - it's not about picking the good guys, it's a choice what would be the lesser of two evils.

If it would actually be a choice and not decided for us humans.

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orion1836
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Re: Page 164: Smells like buttocks!

Post by orion1836 »

'Bad' or 'Good' is a matter for the history books. Nations act in their own self interest, with admittedly a few exceptions (the US and EU in modern times). In cases like this, one can only expect the Umiak and Loroi are acting in their own interest as well. From what I've seen presented in the comic, Loroi self-interest aligns more closely with Humanity's priorities than Umiak self-interest.

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GeoModder
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Re: Page 164: Smells like buttocks!

Post by GeoModder »

Murph wrote:But, who are the good guys (or gals) and who are the bad guys? I suspect the Umiak are bad guys, but the others? Hmmmmm.

You forgot the ugly guys… remember the movie, the good, the bad, and the ugly.
Image

boldilocks
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Re: Page 164: Smells like buttocks!

Post by boldilocks »

orion1836 wrote:Nations act in their own self interest, with admittedly a few exceptions (the US and EU in modern times).
Uuuuuuuuh...

boldilocks
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Re: Page 164: Smells like buttocks!

Post by boldilocks »

GeoModder wrote:
Murph wrote:But, who are the good guys (or gals) and who are the bad guys? I suspect the Umiak are bad guys, but the others? Hmmmmm.

You forgot the ugly guys… remember the movie, the good, the bad, and the ugly.
Humans are the ugly guys. We were hoping to be clint eastwood, but I don't think he's alive anymore.

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cacambo43
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Re: Page 164: Smells like buttocks!

Post by cacambo43 »

raistlin34 wrote:
Murph wrote:But, who are the good guys (or gals) and who are the bad guys? I suspect the Umiak are bad guys, but the others? Hmmmmm.
Why do you assume this is a bad guys(or gals) vs good guys scenario?
I don't know about "good" or "bad", per se, but I take my cue from how the "Dramatis Personae" Insider page is set up. Humans. Loroi. And then the Umiak lumped with "Aliens". I find it ironic, given that "alien" means "outsider", but more to the point: The Loroi are set up here on a near equal footing to the Humans, while the Umiak are placed in a second tier.

CJSF

Luge
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Re: Page 164: Smells like buttocks!

Post by Luge »

Treebeard wrote:Side? I am on nobody's side, because nobody is on my side
Worth bearing in mind. Humanity hasn't joined a "side" yet.

L.

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CrimsonFALKE
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Re: Page 164: Smells like buttocks!

Post by CrimsonFALKE »

Man the internet really ruined our minds

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SaintofM
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Re: Page 164: Smells like buttocks!

Post by SaintofM »

I am also going to have to agree with the no good guys in this scinario. This is more like Warhammer 40K where the nominal good guys are Space Romans (Ultra Marines), Space Vikings with Lycantrhopy issues (Space Wolves), and big guys with a thing for flamethrowers (Salamanders), and Tau.

Its all about survival.

Or a case like with the Halo Video Game series.

John 117 and the other Spartan IIs were not created to deal with the alien threat, just a bunch of rebels. THe Spartan III's were organized to deal with the alien threat, but they were expendable, angry war orphans that were often sent of suicide missions.

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Re: Page 164: Smells like buttocks!

Post by Murph »

I don't agree, I think you have "good guys", meaning they are less bad than the alternative. But we have games within games within games being played in 4D chess.

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