Miscellaneous Loroi question-and-answer thread

[sunphoenix]

I have a question... lol.

The Loroi being a mostly telepathic race as their personal communications are usually non-verbal... do they kiss as a sign of affection?

And if they don't what would they think of the human practice?

... if you can't answer because that might spoil the mystery of the story... I'm fine with that!

[Arioch]

The Loroi being a mostly telepathic race as their personal communications are usually non-verbal... do they kiss as a sign of affection?

Since Loroi have a taboo against casual touching, I think you can probably guess that they don't kiss in public.

Kissing would be one element of sexual contact between male and female, done in private.

[Hālian]

What are the average January and July temperatures (low and high) and rainfall in Torridas and Menelos? In that vein, what Earthican cities do the best job of trying to approximate their weather?

Can you tell us about the Philosophers? How many of them are named Bruce?

Also, perhaps the sister worlds page should be updated? How can the Listel hometown be named Upway when there's no <w> or <y> in Trade?

e: Also also, perhaps you could write an Insider page on Crossfire? :3

[discord]

cj: i can answer question #3, because it's a trade word that TRANSLATES as upway.

[sunphoenix]

The Loroi being a mostly telepathic race as their personal communications are usually non-verbal... do they kiss as a sign of affection?

Since Loroi have a taboo against casual touching, I think you can probably guess that they don't kiss in public.

Kissing would be one element of sexual contact between male and female, done in private.

Interesting. I was not certain that loroi would ever see the need to socially develop such a type of contact 'as kissing' - seeing as they can far more intimately contact each other's mind directly without the clumsiness of physical contact. Of course, other than the need for such physical contact as in procreation.

Like some Eskimo tribes of earth kissing was not something they socially developed either because to show intimate affection they would rub noses.

Fascinating. The Loroi turn out to be more human-like than I expected... at least in some of their social interaction. They apparently developed along similar social lines of personal interaction similar to humaniti of a sorts.

Thanks for the Answer Arioch!

...blood as souls for thee!

[Grayhome]

So why do Loroi not like aliens to be around? Why conquer them at all in the first place then.

[Arioch]

So why do Loroi not like aliens to be around? Why conquer them at all in the first place then.

For the same reason that the Western democracies conquered Germany and Japan: the other guys started it first. The only war (against aliens) that the Loroi ever started was the Third Mannadi War, which was essentially just a continuation of the first two wars, started by the Mannadi.

[kernly]

For the same reason that the Western democracies conquered Germany and Japan: the other guys started it first.

If it was anything like that, it wasn't nearly as simple as that. It also seems very incongruous for an obviously weaker power to "start it" against an obviously stronger power. Let's look at WW2: there wasn't a very apparent strong side or weak side. Indeed, the Axis powers were at a very distinct tactical advantage at the outset, and it was only gross errors in strategy that prevented them from driving home that advantage into some wider victory. Wars tend to happen because of one of two scenarios - either both belligerents have reason to think that they're in a position that they can use to achieve victory, or a clearly stronger belligerent forces a clearly weaker power into a fight.

In the case of the Loroi versus the non-Umiak, well, it seems kinda unrealistic that the exceedingly wimpy non-Umiak species would "start it." Like if instead of the European powers with their fleets of warships with cannons forcing themselves on natives with far inferior technology, those natives tried to invade Europe with rowboats and spears.

[Arioch]

There wasn't anything "wimpy" about the nations that attacked the Loroi; each was comparable in size and power (at least on paper) to the Loroi at their respective stages of history. The Loroi did not always have a massive empire or huge fleets.

There were only two major alien conflicts prior to the current war: the war with the Delrias early in the colonization period, and the series of wars against the Mannadi and their allies. I think it could be said that the Mannadi grossly underestimated the Loroi (in a similar manner to which the Japanese grossly underestimated the Americans), but in the Delrias conflict most oddsmakers would have considered the Loroi the underdog.

I also don't agree that the Axis forces had a clear advantage before the start of WWII; the Allied forces substantially outnumbered them on both fronts (again, on paper). It was a series of stunning early victories that put the Axis ahead (and exposed Allied weaknesses), and one can say now with hindsight that these victories were to be expected, but at the time that the decision was made to attack, those victories were by no means a sure thing.

[Hālian]

What are the average January and July temperatures (low and high) and rainfall in Torridas and Menelos? In that vein, what Earthican cities do the best job of trying to approximate their weather?

Can you tell us about the Philosophers? How many of them are named Bruce?

Also, perhaps the sister worlds page should be updated? How can the Listel hometown be named Upway when there's no <w> or <y> in Trade?

e: Also also, perhaps you could write an Insider page on Crossfire? :3

:<?

[Arioch]

What are the average January and July temperatures (low and high) and rainfall in Torridas and Menelos? In that vein, what Earthican cities do the best job of trying to approximate their weather?

Can you tell us about the Philosophers? How many of them are named Bruce?

Also, perhaps the sister worlds page should be updated? How can the Listel hometown be named Upway when there's no <w> or <y> in Trade?

e: Also also, perhaps you could write an Insider page on Crossfire? :3

:<?

I assumed that you were joking. Were those meant to be serious questions?

[Hālian]

I was joking about the Philosophers, but the rest are serious.

[Jericho]

If it was anything like that, it wasn't nearly as simple as that. It also seems very incongruous for an obviously weaker power to "start it" against an obviously stronger power. Let's look at WW2: there wasn't a very apparent strong side or weak side. Indeed, the Axis powers were at a very distinct tactical advantage at the outset, and it was only gross errors in strategy that prevented them from driving home that advantage into some wider victory. Wars tend to happen because of one of two scenarios - either both belligerents have reason to think that they're in a position that they can use to achieve victory, or a clearly stronger belligerent forces a clearly weaker power into a fight.

In the case of the Loroi versus the non-Umiak, well, it seems kinda unrealistic that the exceedingly wimpy non-Umiak species would "start it." Like if instead of the European powers with their fleets of warships with cannons forcing themselves on natives with far inferior technology, those natives tried to invade Europe with rowboats and spears.

The loroi's strength is their telepathy. And that can't really be measured on paper. It's sort of like playing a FPS against a wall hacker, you could have better skills weapons or experience or even outnumber your enemy but they are still going to win because they have an edge that supersedes conventional rules within that system.

So in terms of every conventional means the delrias had the edge but not great enough to overcome the unseen advantage of the loroi. Which gives us an even bigger clue on the full potential of the umiak war machine. They are not only fighting a war against an enemy of similar size and technology, they are fighting a war against a cheater and they are actually winning (or so it's seems).

[Arioch]

I was joking about the Philosophers, but the rest are serious.

Toridas would be similar in climate and geography to Bergen, Norway. Menelos is located on a great river at the southern end of a large but cold desert; I can't think of any obvious Earth analogues. I don't have any average temperature or rainfall figures for you.

There are no Loroi philosophers named Bruce.

"Upway" is an English translation (similar to "Fireblade"), not a Trade word.

When I have more details for Crossfire worked out, I will share them with you.

[kernly]

I also don't agree that the Axis forces had a clear advantage before the start of WWII; the Allied forces substantially outnumbered them on both fronts (again, on paper). It was a series of stunning early victories that put the Axis ahead (and exposed Allied weaknesses), and one can say now with hindsight that these victories were to be expected, but at the time that the decision was made to attack, those victories were by no means a sure thing.

You're right. From the perspective of anyone on the ground, things weren't "clear." I think both sides thought their military capabilities were closer than they were - but the Nazis were better informed at the outset, and knew they were in the stronger position before hostilities began.

I feel that the tactical advantage was "clear" in the following sense: in the beginning, was no "both" fronts. The Soviets were (suspicious and untrusted) allies. If the resources of Operation Barbarossa had been devoted to destroying Britain, there is little doubt that Britain would have fallen. I think that the Nazi's tactical advantage was as clear from an informed observer's standpoint - anyone who looked at Germany's military next to Britain's or France's could not have doubted the outcome. On paper, their planes were faster and more durable and more numerous and better able to communicate with ground forces, their armored forces were more maneuverable and better able to communicate, their U-boats were incredibly capable with no Allied counter. Of course, that comparative analysis wasn't available to any individual at the time, but I do think that with modern intelligence gathering standards the situation would have been very clearly assessed, and the initial outcome predicted.

Which makes me wonder - what is intelligence gathering like in a space-fleet scenario? In the Outsider universe, is there a lot of holding ships a few jumps back so that scouting missions don't see them? Are there lots of deep scouting missions by both sides? Is there a viable way to totally block yourself from being scouted - how effectively can you station a superior force at the in-jump zone of a star and totally prevent a given ship from jumping in, charging up and jumping out before they get shot?

[Arioch]

Which makes me wonder - what is intelligence gathering like in a space-fleet scenario? In the Outsider universe, is there a lot of holding ships a few jumps back so that scouting missions don't see them? Are there lots of deep scouting missions by both sides? Is there a viable way to totally block yourself from being scouted - how effectively can you station a superior force at the in-jump zone of a star and totally prevent a given ship from jumping in, charging up and jumping out before they get shot?

A scout that jumps into your system has to reverse its vector before it can jump back out, which will generally take several hours at least. Also, both sides will usually have patrols in the outlying frontier that will give warning of incoming vessels, so it will be a dangerous proposition for lone scouts to try to get in and out of enemy systems unscathed. So, border reconnaissance will generally have to be done in force. The Umiak do it with large-scale assaults, and the Loroi do it with with smaller raider groups directed by Farseers to hit the gaps in protection. In both cases, the "reconnaissance" force will usually try to hurt something while they're there.

However, it's extremely difficult see past the border system to the interior of the enemy's territory, so if the enemy wants to build reserves that you don't know about, all they have to do is not station them right on the border systems. Both sides are currently doing this with their reserves, so neither side has clear intelligence. The Loroi have an advantage in this department with Farseers and telepathic interrogation, but there are limits to both.

In peacetime, intelligence gathering was a bit easier; Loroi and Umiak vessels were not allowed past the border systems, but it wasn't that hard to get local proxies to penetrate the interior. The limitation for Loroi intelligence in this period was that the Umiak strictly controlled movement of their own client populations within Umiak territory, even during peacetime.

[Hālian]

What are the color codes for the uniforms and rank tabs?

[Arioch]

Do you mean the RGB values?

[Hālian]

Yes.

COMPLETELY OFF-TOPIC: You should join us on IRC sometime :3

[Grayhome]

I noticed that in the psychokinetic thread in the Insider PK shield was labeled as being able to stop sonic attacks.

Nub question, but I thought from my science lessons that sound was a form of energy? Or am I misremembering my lessons.