Miscellaneous Loroi question-and-answer thread

[Suederwind]

Ah, well... A WW2 discussion in the Loroi question thread, I didn't see that one coming.

Just a few thoughts on that topic:
Yes, a sane German leadership would have never started that war, the holocast and a lot of other very bad things. However, they did what they did and were a bunch of insane, drug addicted megalomaniacs. There was no way they would have chosen a different path.

There were a lot of plots an assassination attempts against Hitler, but somehow he survived all of them. For example: Georg Elsner build a bomb inside the Bürgerbräukeller (a place were the Nazis held a lot of speeches) and Hitler survived just because he left early. Another attempt failed, because the acidtrigger for a bomb on a plane he took to the eastern fron, had frozen in flight.
There is a nice listhere.

I don't remember the source, but I have heard somewhere that the USA could have had 3 additional bombs ready till the end of 1945. not sure if that is true.
You should however not forgett that the Germans had a few tricks ready at that time and if we assume that they had won the war against the UDSSR and the UK, there would have been even more. Maybe not nuclear weapons, but other advanced stuff like the Jetfighter/bomber, guided missiles, early ICBMs (A9/A10), etc...
Not sure what kind of impact that would have had on an US attack against Germany, but I will try that out in my next HoI3 game.

Well, one more, slightly on topic question: What would the Loroi think about this part of the human history?

[Arioch]

Will the Loroi try to control the information the Mozin's courier Prophet's Reason has about the new human race? How much do the Loroi try to control information? Among themselves or their allies? Is it likely that the Historians and/or the Barsam would try to send their own mission towards human space (based off of a guess since they have no idea where humanity is actually located)? Would the Loroi inform them?

If the intent was to keep Alex's presence a secret, Mozin and the Historian would not have been informed of his existence. On the contrary, Tempo included them in the meeting specifically because she knew they would disseminate the information.

Among Loroi, their telepathy often makes it difficult to keep a secret, and the Loroi code of honor places a high value on honesty. Among alien allies, most Loroi do not feel the same compelling need for honesty, and will withhold information if there is a practical reason... but it is not their first impulse to lie.

A third-party search mission is unlikely at this point, since nobody knows where the Prabhu is. "Ten jumps" doesn't narrow the search by much; ten jumps can easily cross a volume of space 50 light years on a side, containing hundreds of stars. When each transit takes days or weeks, that's not a volume that can be searched in a timely manner, even when there are not Umiak vessels milling around. As a comparison, traveling from Sol to the limit of human territory takes only six jumps. Even when Alex tells them exactly where to go, it will take some planning; it's a long way to travel into contested territory.

Well, one more, slightly on topic question: What would the Loroi think about this part of the human history?

The Loroi spent most of their history at war, so there's not much that happened during our world wars that the Loroi would not find familiar. The global scale of the conflict and the technological nature of the warfare would probably be most remarkable to them. The wars of the equivalent period in Deinar history were fought almost entirely with infantry.

[Suederwind]

Almost entirely faught with infantry? Didn't they have the technology (or resources?) or was it considered dishonorable to use planes, tanks, etc? Am I right to imagine those wars a lot like WW1 (although maybe a bit smaller)?
Were there cases of genocide among Loroi (I mean Loroi people A vs Loroi people B)?

[discord]

mackus: little known fact, it was the great britain that declared war on germany first, not the the other way around.

britain and france declared 'you fuck with poland, we go to war!' hitler called their bluff.....oops, was not a bluff.

really should get hoi3...seems like a fun time.

[fredgiblet]

I've heard that HoI 2 is the better one, but I haven't played either yet. I own 2, but I have about 100 games on Steam ahead of it.

[GeoModder]

mackus: little known fact, it was the great britain that declared war on germany first, not the the other way around.

Little known? AFAIK, that "little fact" has never been written out of history books...
What was most remarkable to me was the 'phoney war' effort after the conquest of Polen.

[Suederwind]

I have both, hoi2 and hoi3. To me hoi2 was much easier to get into than hoi3. I have no idea why they had to include that terrible command system into the game, the way they did with hoi3. Way too much micromanagment for my taste.

The phoney war or "Sitzkrieg" was maybe the most stupid thing done by the Allies in WW2. They could have won the war so early and easy, its almost like some kind of sick joke that they didn't even try.

[Arioch]

Almost entirely faught with infantry? Didn't they have the technology (or resources?) or was it considered dishonorable to use planes, tanks, etc? Am I right to imagine those wars a lot like WW1 (although maybe a bit smaller)?

Pretty much from the iron age to the early industrial era, warfare didn't change much for the Loroi: the standard unit was ranked, armored infantry with melee weapons. There was no cavalry because Deinar did not have a horse equivalent. Because the infantry units were led by Unsheathed officers with telekinesis who could usually deflect missile weapons, archery and other missiles were functionally very limited. Partially because of these things, and partially because of the rigidity of Loroi customs in general, there was not a great push toward increasing military technology. By the early industrial era, the Deinar Loroi had steam engines and better metallurgy, but no gunpowder or siege weapons (any large military engines were easy prey for Teidar). By the late industrial era, Loroi infantry were using firearms, but only small arms and not artillery or other war machines like tanks or aircraft (again, vulnerable to Teidar). It was not trench warfare; trenches were mostly a defense against artillery. The Loroi world war was fought with 1990's technology, complete with jets and armored vehicles, but it was not a total war like WWII.

Were there cases of genocide among Loroi (I mean Loroi people A vs Loroi people B)?

Yes. Most Loroi wars were limited affairs in which civilians were not targeted and the conflict was concluded by treaty (as in 18th century Europe), but when things got out of control and the war became total, it was not unusual to have to wipe out the entire warrior class of the losing side. Civilians and males were not sacrosanct, but were usually captured rather than killed because they were useful and didn't represent a military threat. There were exceptions, of course; the Loroi had their share of maniacs. Imagine the body counts Genghis Khan could have racked up if he had been telekinetic and had lived for 400 years.

[fredgiblet]

Did the Loroi ever use nukes on each other?

[Arioch]

Did the Loroi ever use nukes on each other?

Yes, but not in the pre-starflight period. Nuclear technology existed at the time of the Deinar world war between the Zaral and Arran alliances, but that was during an era of courtly military manners; the military forces met in open battle, and the losers accepted the outcome. Mutual destruction was not a consideration. Deterrent was considered to be cowardly; if you were a true warrior of the period, your attitude toward conflict was "bring it on, and let the chips fall where they may."

There were two interstellar civil wars in which nuclear (or worse) warheads were used, but the targets were military and not civilian (though there was no doubt a certain amount of collateral damage).

[edit] The above refers to Deinar history. The Perrein Loroi did have an atomic war.

[Grayhome]

Sooooo... why did anyone think giving these people total control over their society was a good idea again? I mean every alien species which bowed to the Loroi pretty much guaranteed they would never again know peace.

[Zakharra]

Are there any cultural/racial weaknesses of the Loroi that have been exploited by any other races?

[fredgiblet]

Sooooo... why did anyone think giving these people total control over their society was a good idea again? I mean every alien species which bowed to the Loroi pretty much guaranteed they would never again know peace.

If the options are "Join us willingly and have a say in things" or "We kill half your population and then take over completely" it's not much of a choice.

[Arioch]

Sooooo... why did anyone think giving these people total control over their society was a good idea again? I mean every alien species which bowed to the Loroi pretty much guaranteed they would never again know peace.

The "bring it on" mentality was a feature of pre-starflight Deinar Loroi warrior society... when the Loroi had no one to fight but each other. Since the rediscovery of the splinter colonies, starflight, and alien races, the Loroi continue to have a warrior culture, but they have mostly avoided external conflict. Since reunification, the Loroi have mostly been the sort of militarists that prefer to build a large military, but not get it dirty by using it. The only war against aliens the Loroi ever started was against the Mannadi, and that was because their allies the Neridi and Pipolsid begged them to. The Loroi are loyal friends, and bitter enemies... but they're not warmongers.

Are there any cultural/racial weaknesses of the Loroi that have been exploited by any other races?

The Loroi are not very strong in research, finance, commerce, or manufacturing, and the Pipolsid, Barsam, Neridi and Delrias, have used their own advantages in these fields to increase their influence and worth within the Union.

[Hālian]

What happened between 1795 and 2110?

Also what are the loroi units of length, mass/weight, and temperature?

[discord]

geomodder: not written out of the history books(except the japanese possibly), no, but every other media down plays it greatly and everyone always says 'hitler started ww2' like he declared war on the world, he did in fact not do that, he did declare war on plenty of neighbors, but he did have a decent excuse for a casus belli for them(reunification).

[GeoModder]

geomodder: not written out of the history books(except the japanese possibly), no, but every other media down plays it greatly and everyone always says 'hitler started ww2' like he declared war on the world, he did in fact not do that, he did declare war on plenty of neighbors, but he did have a decent excuse for a casus belli for them(reunification).

IOW, he played with the same fire that started WWI: treaty commitments. He should have remembered his own time in the trenches, and that sooner or later there's always somebody to call the bully's bluff.

[Zakharra]

Are there any cultural/racial weaknesses of the Loroi that have been exploited by any other races?

The Loroi are not very strong in research, finance, commerce, or manufacturing, and the Pipolsid, Barsam, Neridi and Delrias, have used their own advantages in these fields to increase their influence and worth within the Union.

Oh. Very nice. That means humanity has a potential edge given time. How would the Loroi take human technological progress in the past and now? I don't remember if it was mentioned how long it took the Loroi to go from primitive planes (Kitty Hawk type) to high speed prop planes to jets and rockets. Would that surprise and worry them?

On another topic, is there any Loroi food Alex can eat that doesn't make him ill, sick and is actually nutritious for him?

[Murica]

geomodder: not written out of the history books(except the japanese possibly), no, but every other media down plays it greatly and everyone always says 'hitler started ww2' like he declared war on the world, he did in fact not do that, he did declare war on plenty of neighbors, but he did have a decent excuse for a casus belli for them(reunification).

IOW, he played with the same fire that started WWI: treaty commitments. He should have remembered his own time in the trenches, and that sooner or later there's always somebody to call the bully's bluff.

Actually hitler wasn't an infantryman like most people think most people think that because that's what he claimed to have been he was actually a messenger that plus I'm pretty sure it's been proven hitler wasn't exactly sane he probably remembered what happened and just didn't care

[fredgiblet]

Oh. Very nice. That means humanity has a potential edge given time. How would the Loroi take human technological progress in the past and now? I don't remember if it was mentioned how long it took the Loroi to go from primitive planes (Kitty Hawk type) to high speed prop planes to jets and rockets. Would that surprise and worry them?

We're low enough down on the tech tree that it won't worry them, they can bring us into the fold pretty easily at this point, and in doing so guarantee that we never have the military strength to threaten them.

On another topic, is there any Loroi food Alex can eat that doesn't make him ill, sick and is actually nutritious for him?

Yes. If you check out the Chapter 2 splash page that's what Alex is doing, determining what he can keep down.