Grayhome wrote:I reiterate my awe at which Arioch has created an entire civilization of creatures which are entirely unlikable in any way, shape or form. I literally cannot find anything even remotely redeemable or likable about what Arioch has revealed to us about the Loroi as a species. A society to which extermination itself would be an improvement upon the quality of life they currently endure. If the Loroi looked like this: [images of Mind Flayers and Brain Bugs] There is not a single one of you who would have any other reaction than KILL IT WITH FIRE.
The Loroi are certainly intended to be a martial society that doesn't share many of our values to begin with, and who are in a desperate position in a genocidal war which they are in danger of losing. They are meant to seem extreme, as are the Umiak, and that's part of what drives the story. What constitutes good and evil is highly subjective and subject to debate, and if you believe that the Loroi are evil, that's a valid point of view. However, I feel you're putting a somewhat stilted spin on things, along with some unfounded speculation and outright distortion of the "facts". It's not my intention to dismiss or discount your views, but let me offer an alternate spin.
For starters, I don't think it's fair to equate telepathic interrogation with examples in which the subject's brain is literally sucked out of his skull, killing him. The interrogation of Alex, however unpleasant or morally repugnant, did not permanently harm him.
Grayhome wrote:-stood by and did nothing while an innocent child was tortured, mentally and physically. Child turns out is an ambassador to a race which possesses territory vital to the current war. Whoops.
Alex is older than Beryl, so I'm not sure why she would be expected to regard him as a child. She apologized to Alex for his treatment and asserted that there was nothing she could do to prevent it. Even if we are predisposed to disbelieve her, it's not clear what one might expect Beryl to have done, since she was not present at the time of the interrogation, and had been sent out of the room by the highest ranking officer on the ship. What was done to Alex could certainly be characterized as torture, but I think recent events here on Earth have shown that a society does not have to be either monstrous or fascist to resort to such practices in time of crisis.
Grayhome wrote:-part of a death worshiping society of stone age xenocidal maniacs who are only out in space due to scavenging through the garbage of a dead civilization.
In what respect do the Loroi worship death?
Grayhome wrote:-believes in mind raping people into drooling submission (see Golim), considers this state of mind "loyalty", "friendship" and the highest possible honor bestowable upon non-Loroi (and probably Loroi as well who disagree with the state).
I don't see any evidence for this. The issue of Golim susceptibility to telepathy is accidental, and the Loroi were sufficiently concerned about it to set up rules that would allow some Golim to live outside of Loroi influence. It is the Golim who consider the state of mesmerization to be beneficial, not the Loroi. Even if it were true that the Golim susceptibility was somehow engineered by the long-ago Loroi ancestors (which is by no means demonstrated), I don't see how the Loroi of today would be in any way culpable for this.
Grayhome wrote:-is quite obviously a member of a race of biological androids created for slavery and food, which were created artificially, transported artificially to three different worlds, developed in three different biospheres, all of which featured non-native technology/flora/fauna, calls her race "naturally occurring". Demonstrates such a complete lack of even the most basic understanding of biological evolution and engineering she might as well be from a stone age society. Such an astoundingly ignorant creature is unworthy of holding a laser pistol.
Beryl never claimed that the Loroi are "naturally occurring." She described the Loroi reproductive advantage as a "basic adaptation for a warrior species." Since the warrior species that she knows of -- the Loroi, Barsam, Delrias and Umiak -- all have similar adaptations, I don't see this assertion as particularly remarkable.
Grayhome wrote:
-her bio-roid species has numerous genetic augmentations which make any and all fights they get into with a non-augmented species trivial, forgone conclusions. Complete and total systematic slaughters entirely in the favor of the Loroi, she thinks this makes them "the perfect warrior race". (ie; endless fatigue, extended lifespan, longevity, resilience to disease, easy pregnancy, fast maturation, reduced consumption, telepathy, psychokinetics, etc.)
I'm not sure how the supposed fact of her race's engineered origin is something to be held against Beryl personally. As far as I'm aware, Beryl has never said anything to indicate that she believes that Loroi are "perfect."
Grayhome wrote:-Said augmentation also results in mental instability caused by chemical imbalances in the brain. All Loroi who we have been given GURPS spreadsheets for have mental quirks which would have automatically disqualified them from military service. She is no exception to this (fear of tight, enclosed spaces which she cannot easily escape from).
In general, the quirks and disadvantages of the Loroi characters are due to their harsh experiences of being born into a world of total warfare (or, for the older Loroi, having to adapt to such a world), and have nothing to do with their supposed genetic adaptations. Specifically, Beryl has a
mild agoraphobia (which is the fear of open spaces, not the fear of confined spaces), resulting from traumatic experiences in her child-band in the open deserts of Mezan, and in no way interferes with her ability to do her job aboard a starship. I would think the fact that the Loroi characters can be emotionally scarred by trauma would be seen as evidence of their humanity, rather than evidence of their monstrosity.
Which of
Tempo's quirks do you feel would disqualify her for military service?
Grayhome wrote:A fate which (in association with the rest of Tempest's crew) she has subjected Alex to continuously since his initial capture, not to mention his mental and physical torture, poisoning, and telepathically raping him while he slept, preventing him from entering REM sleep.
The assertion that Alex was deliberately poisoned or sleep-deprived is, as far as I can tell, without foundation in the comic.
Grayhome wrote:There would be no alliance. Telepathic mind raping space elves would gather as much human bio material as they needed to discover a way around human resistance to telepathy and then mind rape a few leaders into drooling, mindless obedience- are we reading the same story here?
I'm not sure that you're reading the same story that I'm writing. It seems that you're offended as much by your own speculation (most of which is incorrect, as it happens) as by what appears on the page.
cacambo43 wrote:But this is really speculation, as ARIOCH HASN'T DRAWN OR WRITTEN ANYTHING IN FOREVER!!!
I'll take my share of the blame for lack of content that encourages wild speculation... nature and psychology both abhor a vacuum. Updates should resume with the new year, and fill some of that vacuum. One of the things that I hope will become more clear is that the Loroi are individual characters, and not of one heart or one mind about anything.
Grayhome wrote:I would consider forming an alliance with the Loroi on the following terms
1: The Loroi recognize that the condition of the Golim, as a species, is the product of a artificially induced genetic augmentation (Slave Mentality and 5 levels of Weak Will according to GURPS) by science, most likely through a virus administered to their atmosphere by persons hereto unknown. They will acknoeledge that this is therefore, neither friendship, or loyalty.
2: The Loroi immediately cede all Golim territory, and make reparations for the generations of enslavement that they have the absolute audacity of calling "loyalty" and "friendship". These reparations shall take the form of material and money, which will be used to de-augment the Golim.
3: The Loroi will never. Ever. For any reason whatsoever. Use any form of Telepathy, Psychokinetics, or any other pychic ability on a human being. Ever. The Loroi use these abilities almost exclusively for murder, and their own selfish gain. Those trained in their usage have been demonstrated to be mentally unstable, if not criminally insane. They are therefore not fit in any way, shape or form to be anywhere NEAR an individual from a neutral power, let alone an Ambassador.
While the circumstances of any such negotiation are hypothetical at this point, it's difficult to imagine a situation in which Humanity would be in any position to make such demands. Assuming that Humanity has something that either side wants, there is likely very little that Humanity could do to stop them from taking it by force.
edit: Anyway, how would the Human negotiators even know that the Golim exist?
Grayhome wrote:He is an ambassador.
To a Neutral Power.
Which occupies strategically vital territory.
Which will turn the tide.
In the current war.
Assuming for the moment that this is true, how would the Loroi commander who has been making the decisions regarding Alex be expected to know this? How would Alex even know it?
Grayhome wrote:That the Loroi have been so far, unable or unwilling to walk down the hall, have a nice little chat with Alex, and determine this basic.
Obvious.
Fact.
Makes their incompetence incredibly plain to me.
Especially given the suspicious circumstances surrounding Alex's sudden appearance, why does it seem unreasonable that the Loroi commander might doubt the truth of what he has to say? Has there never been a Human commander who took actions that were stubborn, short-sighted, or colored by his prejudices? Is that the same thing as stupidity or incompetence? Is the entire Human race stupid and incompetent because of the actions of a single commander?